TPU Continuum

Author Topic: TPU Continuum (Read 53456 times)

Topic Options

TinMan

Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #100 on: 2019-02-10, 06:56:07 »

Group: Elite Experimentalist
Hero Member

Posts: 4727

Quote from: ion on 2019-02-10, 03:42:00

Hi Luc

Nice demo video of the operation of the flux switcher.

Question: what thickness are the yellow spacers and what is the material made of?

I would be curious to know what effect a pulse of various energy levels is required to just switch the AlNiCo, without the Neos in the circuit, and what Gauss level you get at the poles vs energy in.

Then compare that to the equivalent steady state power required just using a piece of soft steel in place of the AlNiCo.

I'm wondering if pulse energy could be made very sharp from a much higher voltage source with less duty cycle, and what effect that would have.

Regards,

I believe the spacers Luc used were actually ferrite magnets them self.

I agree that this should be looked into further,as i believe it takes very little energy to flip the poles of an alnico magnet.

One way to do it would be to use a cap,dump the cap across the flipping coil,and keep increasing the voltage of the cap until the poles flipped. We can then work out how many joules of energy is required to flip the poles.

Brad

---------------------------

Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

JimBoot

Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #101 on: 2019-02-10, 07:46:37 »

Group: Tinkerer
Hero Member

Posts: 1783

Quote from: ion on 2019-02-10, 04:06:46

Hi Jim
Large and small speakers of the 40's, 50's, 60's and D'Arsonval meters movements or large to small and even toy PM motors to name a few. Anything before the ceramic magnet era.

excellent thanks mate. Ok think I have one. Might be overkill for the job tho.

------------------------

Screen Shot 2019-02-10 at 7.23.15 PM.png

TPU Continuum

Screen Shot 2019-02-10 at 7.23.15 PM.png (1677.96 kB, 1397x674 - viewed 859 times.)

« Last Edit: 2019-02-10, 08:24:27 by JimBoot »

JimBoot	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #102 on: 2019-02-10, 08:33:25 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 1783	Wow it's surprising how easily the poles flip just using a ferrite magnet

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #103 on: 2019-02-10, 09:32:05 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Quote from: JimBoot on 2019-02-10, 08:33:25 Wow it's surprising how easily the poles flip just using a ferrite magnet Hey Jim What did you get the magnet out of ? And yes,the poles in an alnico can be flipped easily,which tells me that it would not require much electrical power to do the same job. Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

JimBoot	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #104 on: 2019-02-10, 09:53:56 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 1783	I think I'm flipping at 50ma 6v. I'm current limiting at 50ma. Getting spikes of 300V plus. No current measurement yet. Pretty sure it's alnico as it's from a 60s speaker. It's a pretty rough setup though. I'm pulsing using a reed straight off the power supply & a MOT coil . I keep adding to this post but I forgot to mention that the mag orientation works the way Luc had it. If the neo is between the keeper and the alnico, the keeper will magnetise. By having the alnico in the middle, the keeper detaches. Got it to spike as low as 3v 50ma. Spikes are lower though, around 120v so maybe it's not flipping completely. « Last Edit: 2019-02-10, 10:25:29 by JimBoot »

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #105 on: 2019-02-10, 10:46:26 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Quote from: gotoluc on 2019-02-10, 02:25:57 And here is a video from 2016 of a test device I made using Roberts idea and going further to a flux gate. You can read Robert's comment below my video. https://youtu.be/0VlhMI5tv5Y Cheers Luc Luc I have watched your video again,and if you still have the bit's lying around,then i have a simple experiment for you. If you charge that cap you used in the video to the 57 volt's you got from the flyback,and are able to flip the alnico's magnetic field using the energy stored in that cap at 57 volt's,then your onto something Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

verpies

Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #106 on: 2019-02-10, 11:11:34 »

Group: Professor
Hero Member

Posts: 3670

Quote from: TinMan on 2019-02-09, 17:02:50

I'll get the parts needed,and one of you EE guys can design the simple switching circuit.

We will need an AC square wave,where the pulse width on each half of the cycle can be altered--say from 2% to 30%,where the positive and negative pulse width alters the same percentage when you turn the pot.
The frequency will need to be around the 50-100Hz range--a starting point.

Does your rectangular AC waveform need to have 3 levels, like this ?:
+V, open, -V
...or like this?:
+V, 0V, -V

...where the +V and -V have the same but adjustable pulse widths

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #107 on: 2019-02-10, 11:17:20 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Quote from: verpies on 2019-02-10, 11:11:34 Does your rectangular AC waveform need to have 3 levels, like this ?: +V, open, -V ...or like this?: +V, 0V, -V ...where the +V and -V have the same but adjustable pulse widths The one highlighted Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

verpies	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #108 on: 2019-02-10, 11:47:15 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3670	Quote from: TinMan on 2019-02-10, 11:17:20 The one highlighted Do you realize the +V,0V,-V is a 3-level waveform during which the coil is effectively shorted when the +V or -V pulses are absent ? Why? A: Because when 1 side of the coil is connected to 0V and the other side is connected to 0V, too, then it means a "short" for the coil.

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #109 on: 2019-02-10, 12:47:17 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Quote from: verpies on 2019-02-10, 11:47:15 Do you realize the +V,0V,-V is a 3-level waveform during which the coil is effectively shorted when the +V or -V pulses are absent ? Why? A: Because when 1 side of the coil is connected to 0V and the other side is connected to 0V, too, then it means a "short" for the coil. No,it means that the current may continue to flow through the coil,thus aiding in the poll flip. Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

verpies	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #110 on: 2019-02-10, 16:15:14 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3670	Quote from: TinMan on 2019-02-10, 12:47:17 No,it means that the current may continue to flow through the coil,thus aiding in the poll flip. Yes, shorting the coil helps to maintain any preexisting current flow in it. I just did not know, if this is what you wanted.

gotoluc

Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #111 on: 2019-02-10, 19:19:47 »

Group: Elite Experimentalist
Hero Member

Posts: 901

Quote from: TinMan on 2019-02-10, 10:46:26

Luc

I have watched your video again,and if you still have the bit's lying around,then i have a simple experiment for you.

If you charge that cap you used in the video to the 57 volt's you got from the flyback,and are able to flip the alnico's magnetic field using the energy stored in that cap at 57 volt's,then your onto something

Brad

Hi Brad,

Yes, I still have to components to put it back together.
However, I did mention it took over a Joule of power to re-magnetize and that is no where close as to what is collected from the flyback.

If only we had super conductors we would easily be able to prove Overunity, since creating a magnetic field is free if you have no resistance.
I don't understand why electrical engineering don't consider this fact which whould blow away the conservation of energy BS.

Cheers
Luc

Magluvin

Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #112 on: 2019-02-10, 20:04:10 »

Group: Mad Scientist
Hero Member

Posts: 676

Quote from: TinMan on 2019-02-10, 12:47:17

No,it means that the current may continue to flow through the coil,thus aiding in the poll flip.

Brad

Like using the coil to maintain its magnetic field after the input is disconnected. Used diodes on a pulse motor for this purpose and was able to shorten the coils power in on time and get the same speed on the rotor. We can collect the collapsing field currents or feed them back through the coil to accelerate the rotor to a greater speed.

Mags

Magluvin	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #113 on: 2019-02-10, 20:11:22 »
Group: Mad Scientist Hero Member Posts: 676	Quote from: Magluvin on 2019-02-10, 20:04:10 Like using the coil to maintain its magnetic field after the input is disconnected. Used diodes on a pulse motor for this purpose and was able to shorten the coils power in on time and get the same speed on the rotor. We can collect the collapsing field currents or feed them back through the coil to accelerate the rotor to a greater speed. Mags Some in the past had thought that when we put current across the coil and build the mag field, that when we disconnect the input that the field reverses poles during the collapse period. Not so. the only thing that changes is the fields expansion direction, to a contraction direction. I think MH argued that with me once. lol Mags

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #114 on: 2019-02-11, 00:11:01 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Quote from: Magluvin on 2019-02-10, 20:11:22 Some in the past had thought that when we put current across the coil and build the mag field, that when we disconnect the input that the field reverses poles during the collapse period. Not so. the only thing that changes is the fields expansion direction, to a contraction direction. I think MH argued that with me once. lol Mags I am surprised MH would argue that point. Yes,when the current flowing into the coil is interrupted,the current through the coil will continue to flow in the same direction,but the voltage across the coil will invert. Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #115 on: 2019-02-11, 00:18:22 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Quote from: gotoluc on 2019-02-10, 19:19:47 Hi Brad, Yes, I still have to components to put it back together. However, I did mention it took over a Joule of power to re-magnetize and that is no where close as to what is collected from the flyback. If only we had super conductors we would easily be able to prove Overunity, since creating a magnetic field is free if you have no resistance. I don't understand why electrical engineering don't consider this fact which whould blow away the conservation of energy BS. Cheers Luc Hi Luc The Alnico magnet dose not actually become demagnetised,it is actually flipping the poles. So when you say !remagnetised,it's actually flipping the poles back. I do have an idea in regards to your big setup there,that i believe will result in more stored energy than what was needed to flip the poles. I will draw it up for you. I would put it together myself,but those size alnico magnets are not available on Oz ebay. Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

JimBoot	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #116 on: 2019-02-11, 09:21:12 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 1783	Ferrites behave differently. They don't flip back. At least the one I'm looking at does not. I'v left nasty polarity imperfections on it's surface with a neo . That's it under ferrofilm after a couple of hours . The neos were only on it for a few secs. Thinking about making some custom ferro mags now. ------------------------ TPU Continuum Screen Shot 2019-02-11 at 8.19.07 PM.png (733.78 kB, 680x529 - viewed 706 times.)

JimBoot	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #117 on: 2019-02-11, 11:36:42 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 1783	Brad & Verpies, Mags referenced in the Non-sense thread https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Signal-Generator-PWM-Pulse-Frequency-Duty-Cycle-Adjustable-Module-LCD-Display-1Hz-150Khz-3-3V-30V/32835541668.html. I'll be getting some anyway but thought they maybe useful here.

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #118 on: 2019-02-11, 14:11:39 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Ok,powering on with the topic subject Huge news coming soon As a teaser-- I have found 7 people living in my states capital city that were involved in the TPU in it's infant days. One just so happened to move from Perth(our capital city),down to my home town in Bunbury,and lives here now. He was the head of the investment group put together to actually buy the TPU. His name is Trevor Osborne,and man dose this guy have a history He is one of the head honcho's of the world harmony foundation. One of the key goals for this !world harmony foundation! is to seek and invest in new technologies for the production of electrical power. He also happens to be one of the guys that was present for 2 demonstrations of the TPU here in my states capital city. He also invented a highly efficient alternator,and opened up a production company in perth to produce these alternators. I have found his facebook account,and have sent him a message. But looking at his profile,seems he has not been active since around december 2017 Looking at his picture,i am sure i have seen him at my workplace,and i think my boss may actually be friends with him--which i will ask tomorrow of course. Here is his facebook profile. https://www.facebook.com/trevor.osborne.549/timeline?lst=584740904%3A1253051280%3A1549890892 Now,turns out that Stan Deyo was also right in there among them,and had played a part in putting together the investment team. I have spoken to Stan on the phone on a number of occasions some years back,regarding his VIA drive technology,which was in the time i owned my own boat building company,and was interested in Stan's VIA drive for marine propulsion applications. I have also located Garth Harvey (who was Brian Collins biggest investor) ,and of course lost his investment, and sent him a message,asking him if i could ask him some questions about the whole TPU saga--hope to hear from him as well. Now,i will hold my tongue,and not reveal my source until i know for sure,but word has it tonight that the TPU was actually another device that SM stole and renamed. Looking at the pictures and design that this other source gave me tonight,i think he might be onto it Anyway,more to come as i get intouch with these people--if i can. Exciting time's I mean,one of the biggest players in the early days of the TPU live's right here in my city,and he has seen it working at demo's twice-->how cool is that. Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

Centraflow

Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #119 on: 2019-02-11, 15:15:25 »

Group: Experimentalist
Hero Member

Posts: 3024

Small world Brad, hope all turns out well.

It makes you wonder, if any one of these people has the details why have they not used them!!

I also have a friend in Aus who once was an investor in my work, has stayed in my house here several times, he is involved in the extraction of precious metals from coal slag heaps and the rest is used to make a very strong cement. I will get in touch with him, can't remember exactly where he lives atm.

Regards

Mike

---------------------------

"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
Arthur Schopenhauer, Philosopher, 1788-1860

As a general rule, the most successful person in life is the person that has the best information.

gotoluc	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #120 on: 2019-02-11, 15:34:06 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 901	Quote from: TinMan on 2019-02-11, 00:18:22 Hi Luc The Alnico magnet dose not actually become demagnetised,it is actually flipping the poles. So when you say !remagnetised,it's actually flipping the poles back. I do have an idea in regards to your big setup there,that i believe will result in more stored energy than what was needed to flip the poles. I will draw it up for you. I would put it together myself,but those size alnico magnets are not available on Oz ebay. Brad Well I guess we just have a different way of explaining what happens. Lets say the Alnico top of the magnet is North and the bottom half is South. I then slide it in the center of a coil to flip the poles, however, I reduce the current pulse by about half of what it takes to flip the poles. The result will be a neutralized Alnico magnet with no poles (demagnetize). So the reality when you flip the poles of an Alnico magnet is, the current pulse needs to be longer then just to neutralize it. So the Alnico magnet actually goes through a de-magnetization to re-magnetization cycle to do what you call flipping the poles. Looking forward to the idea you have. My experience of magnet pole flipping or bucking is, it comes at a large cost (CEMF) to the otherwise free magnetic field and why I'm working on designs that isolates and or compliments (work with it) the magnetic field. Regards Luc

ion

Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #121 on: 2019-02-11, 15:52:33 »

Group: Elite
Hero Member

Posts: 3537
It's turtles all the way down

Quote from: gotoluc on 2019-02-11, 15:34:06

Well I guess we just have a different way of explaining what happens.
Lets say the Alnico top of the magnet is North and the bottom half is South. I then slide it in the center of a coil to flip the poles, however, I reduce the current pulse by about half of what it takes to flip the poles. The result will be a neutralized Alnico magnet with no poles (demagnetize).
So the reality when you flip the poles of an Alnico magnet is, the current pulse needs to be longer then just to neutralize it. So the Alnico magnet actually goes through a de-magnetization to re-magnetization cycle to do what you call flipping the poles.

Looking forward to the idea you have.
My experience of magnet pole flipping or bucking is, it comes at a large cost (CEMF) to the otherwise free magnetic field and why I'm working on designs that isolates and or compliments (work with it) the magnetic field.

Regards
Luc

Hi Luc

Here is an interesting experiment: arrange your pulse generator so that it puts a known millijoule pulse of some value into the coil, with about one second or more between pulses so you have time to observe, then observe the strength of the Gauss field at one of the poles with a Gauss meter.

Now does the Gauss field incrementally build with each pulse, or is an increased level of millijoules required to bring the magnet to the next Gauss level?.

I find that I get much stronger effect if I use a flyback diode right across the coil, as the circulating current is used for magnetization rather than being collected elsewhere e.g. in a capacitor or resistor.

Also a "keeper" helps to increase the strength per pulse.

There is a large number of AlNiCo types as well as other materials so it is hard to know what material you actually have unless you have a spec sheet for the material being tested.

https://www.duramag.com/alnico-magnets/available-alnico-magnet-grades/

FWIW
Regards

---------------------------

"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy

verpies	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #122 on: 2019-02-11, 19:34:26 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3670	Quote from: JimBoot on 2019-02-11, 11:36:42 Brad & Verpies, Mags referenced in the Non-sense thread https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Signal-Generator-PWM-Pulse-Frequency-Duty-Cycle-Adjustable-Module-LCD-Display-1Hz-150Khz-3-3V-30V/32835541668.html. I'll be getting some anyway but thought they maybe useful here. This will generate the frequencies but will not generate the 0V-based AC waveform that he desires. For this you need to switch 4 switches (e.g. MOSFETs) like in an H-bridge arrangement: Any 10 cent microcontroller (MCU) can generate the switching sequence above, e.g.: PIC, ATtiny, or Padauk... To get this to work with a cheap MCU, you'd also need 2 low-side and 2 high-side MOSFET drivers...or 1 specialized Full H-Bridge driver IC. ...+ the power MOSFETs themselves. But if you want to use the venerable TL494 then you can add this $1 driver to it and be done with it. ... + some passive components. P.S. ^{The Dead Time needs to be implemented or the switches will short out. One MOSFET body diode conducts during each Dead Time, so the H-bridge is never really open-circuited, but the "dead time" is normally so short, that it would not matter anyway.} ------------------------ TPU Continuum AC Switching Full H-Bridge.png (37.67 kB, 1026x830 - viewed 1364 times.) « Last Edit: 2024-08-09, 01:16:54 by verpies »

JimBoot	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #123 on: 2019-02-11, 20:05:19 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 1783	Quote from: verpies on 2019-02-11, 19:34:26 This will generate the frequencies but will not generate the 0V-based AC waveform that he desires. For this you need to switch 4 switches (e.g. MOSFETs) like this: Any 10 cent microcontroller (MCU) can generate the sequence above, e.g.: PIC, ATtiny, or Paduk... To get this to work with a cheap MCU, you'd also need 2 low-side and 2 high-side MOSFET drivers...or 1 specialized Full H-Bridge driver IC. But if you want to use the venerable TL494 then you can add this $1 driver to it and be done with it. ... + some passive components. P.S. ^{The "dead time" can be only several nanoseconds long, but it needs to be implemented or the switches will short out.} Excellent. Thanks Verpies

TinMan	Re: TPU Continuum « Reply #124 on: 2019-02-12, 02:29:57 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4727	Quote from: verpies on 2019-02-11, 19:34:26 This will generate the frequencies but will not generate the 0V-based AC waveform that he desires. For this you need to switch 4 switches (e.g. MOSFETs) like this: Any 10 cent microcontroller (MCU) can generate the switching sequence above, e.g.: PIC, ATtiny, or Padauk... To get this to work with a cheap MCU, you'd also need 2 low-side and 2 high-side MOSFET drivers...or 1 specialized Full H-Bridge driver IC. ...+ the power MOSFETs themselves. But if you want to use the venerable TL494 then you can add this $1 driver to it and be done with it. ... + some passive components. P.S. ^{The Dead Time needs to be implemented or the switches will short out. One MOSFET body diode conducts during each Dead Time, so the H-bridge is never really open-circuited, but the "dead time" is normally so short, that it would not matter anyway.} Thanks verpies Looks like that is sorted Brad --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.