TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices.

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Author Topic: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. (Read 196342 times)

Erfinder	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #425 on: 2015-08-10, 10:58:20 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: JimBoot on 2015-08-10, 04:16:54 On a dead short on the output it increases to 400ma out whilst input is down around 550ma . On the Tinnie Brad is switching the output with the secondary commutator but that does not look like it happening for the Alexander patent. In the Alexanderson patent, the output is modulated AC, slip rings are depicted in the patent, not a second commutator. That is something that should be taken into consideration. All who are working on this and comparing back and forth should keep that fundamental difference in mind. Second, the "secondary" windings are not located in the same slots as the motor windings, or as an alternative, they are not quadrature phase related to the motor windings, the latter is what I recommend versus the common slot configuration discussed in the patent. Another thing to note is that in the Alexanderson patent we see that his input is very high, the few replicators of either the patent or Tinman are NOT experimenting with high input power as the patent states. I have conducted experiments along these lines using machines of my own conception and construction and do see what could be considered as a blending of the generator and transformer action, however, to get the effect, its necessary that my input requirement be high, just food for thought. Regards

JimBoot	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #426 on: 2015-08-10, 14:37:54 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 1770	Quote from: Erfinder on 2015-08-10, 10:58:20 In the Alexanderson patent, the output is modulated AC, slip rings are depicted in the patent, not a second commutator. That is something that should be taken into consideration. All who are working on this and comparing back and forth should keep that fundamental difference in mind. Second, the "secondary" windings are not located in the same slots as the motor windings, or as an alternative, they are not quadrature phase related to the motor windings, the latter is what I recommend versus the common slot configuration discussed in the patent. Another thing to note is that in the Alexanderson patent we see that his input is very high, the few replicators of either the patent or Tinman are NOT experimenting with high input power as the patent states. I have conducted experiments along these lines using machines of my own conception and construction and do see what could be considered as a blending of the generator and transformer action, however, to get the effect, its necessary that my input requirement be high, just food for thought. Regards Thanks Erfinder, that's what I thought. Just wanted to make sure my thinking was correct. Certainly a lot easier to implement anyway.

TinMan	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #427 on: 2015-08-18, 11:26:11 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4728	Not a free energy device,but great to see the old timer going again. The intention is to get it to run on the waste oil from work that we collect when servicing vehicles. So the fuel cost will be zero to run this-->in fact,as we have to pay to have the waste oil taken away,we will actually be saving money running this motor . So maybe it is a free energy device,as we wont be paying for the fuel lol. And a sneak peak at some up and coming projects. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2SX5gQXemw --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

Grumage	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #428 on: 2015-08-18, 11:56:15 »
Group: Renaissance Man Hero Member Posts: 2765	Quote from: TinMan on 2015-08-18, 11:26:11 Not a free energy device,but great to see the old timer going again. The intention is to get it to run on the waste oil from work that we collect when servicing vehicles. So the fuel cost will be zero to run this-->in fact,as we have to pay to have the waste oil taken away,we will actually be saving money running this motor . So maybe it is a free energy device,as we wont be paying for the fuel lol. And a sneak peak at some up and coming projects. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2SX5gQXemw Dear Brad. That's quite a collection you have!! Nice Detroit Jumbo! That magneto is a Webster Tri polar Oscillator, Low Tension magneto. Very popular type fitted to hundreds of different American engines. I found them all to have weak magnets, that's usually all that's wrong. However the odd one or two had to have the Zinc Alloy end covers replaced as they had self destructed! Shame about the exhaust damage, but I'm sure you will be able to make a sound repair. Cheers Grum. --------------------------- Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

TinMan	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #429 on: 2015-08-18, 23:59:55 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4728	Quote from: Grumage on 2015-08-18, 11:56:15 Dear Brad. That's quite a collection you have!! Nice Detroit Jumbo! That magneto is a Webster Tri polar Oscillator, Low Tension magneto. Very popular type fitted to hundreds of different American engines. I found them all to have weak magnets, that's usually all that's wrong. However the odd one or two had to have the Zinc Alloy end covers replaced as they had self destructed! Shame about the exhaust damage, but I'm sure you will be able to make a sound repair. Cheers Grum. No-not my collection This is my bosses collection,and im getting paid to restore them-well get them running anyway. For every engine i get running,he is going to give me one of the smaller engine's -along with my weekly pay cheque --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

Matt Watts	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #430 on: 2015-08-19, 00:32:58 »
Group: Guest	Looks like some fun projects there Brad. First thing to strike me is the likely weight of all that iron. Do you have some sort of slim pallet jack to move them around or just pure deep breaths and elbow grease?

muDped	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #431 on: 2015-08-19, 05:25:49 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 3055	Yes indeed, those old engines certainly do look heavy! You're a very fortunate man TinMan, to have access to those old beauties. Bringing those old technology machines back to life is one of the most gratifying of endeavors. The old diesel you fired up runs with the sound of music to one's ears. Fantastic! --------------------------- For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be known or brought out into the open.

JimBoot	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #432 on: 2015-08-20, 08:32:08 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 1770	My brother in law is in to restoring similar engines. He would drool at that collection. A nice respite from a he craziness that is Vegas.

TinMan	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #433 on: 2015-08-20, 11:07:15 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4728	Quote from: muDped on 2015-08-19, 05:25:49 Yes indeed, those old engines certainly do look heavy! You're a very fortunate man TinMan, to have access to those old beauties. Bringing those old technology machines back to life is one of the most gratifying of endeavors. The old diesel you fired up runs with the sound of music to one's ears. Fantastic! This one is my favourate muDped- What a rhythm. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJYyJccePh8 --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

Slider2732	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #434 on: 2015-08-20, 17:27:04 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 1399 ... .-.. .. -.. . .-.	TinMan - The only way to improve on that large engine would be if it blew smoke rings with each firing. That was a great vid, sounds like tribal dance beats. Was explaining your work situation to my wife. I was using household items to explain sizings of the engines and said "he gets a desk fan for fixing a clothes basket" lol. I think she understood. --------------------------- ʎɐqǝ from pɹɐoqʎǝʞ a ʎnq ɹǝʌǝu

muDped	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #435 on: 2015-08-21, 22:40:51 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 3055	Quote from: TinMan on 2015-08-20, 11:07:15 This one is my favourate muDped- What a rhythm. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJYyJccePh8 Aye, that is a goodun'! What a beautiful monster! With just a wee bit of TLC that one could run forever. When looking closely at the exhaust plume you'll see that each "puff" shoots a small donut vortex straight up into the air which very rapidly flies up several meters. Really a very pleasant sound. They begin to show up with pretty good regularity at about 18 seconds into the video. The exhaust seems to consist of two major areas; the lower smoke cloud which blows with the wind horizontally away from the machine, and the very speedy toroidal vortex which shoots straight up really, really fast for a surprisingly long distance. At about 1 minute and 20 seconds, near the end of the video, the cameraman shows more of the exhaust stream and they're very pretty. It's a shame that they're not made for such durability today. Well, maybe the Lister. --------------------------- For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be known or brought out into the open.

TinMan	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #436 on: 2015-08-30, 12:42:24 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4728	Today i have come up with a way to make an AC super capacitor. Would there be any use or need for such a capacitor?. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLOkV5qIOgs --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

poynt99	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #437 on: 2015-08-30, 14:23:41 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3217 It's not as complicated as it may seem...	Your comparison to the commercial AC capacitor is not a fair one. A true AC capacitor can not only charge to either polarity, but it does not need to be "trained" to do so. It will carry a continuous AC current. That's why they are called "AC" capacitors. Your cell does not appear to be able to do that. Your cell however is very interesting. Good work! --------------------------- "Some scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute that. I say there is more stupidity than hydrogen, and that is the basic building block of the universe." Frank Zappa

gotoluc	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #438 on: 2015-08-30, 15:54:55 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 901	Great job Brad I think these AC results are very encouraging Luc

TinMan	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #439 on: 2015-08-30, 16:16:19 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4728	Quote from: gotoluc on 2015-08-30, 15:54:55 Great job Brad I think these AC results are very encouraging Luc The cap will work as an AC cap,but the capacity is that great that the AC cycle would have to be very low,and the current flow very high.The one problem though is that the voltage capacity is very low-2.3 volts.We could of course join a few in series to get the voltage up,but i dont really see a use for such an AC cap of this size. But to have a super cap that can be charged in either direction would have it's benefit's. My goal now is to make a 20,000 farad cap the size of a AAA battery. --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

gotoluc	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #440 on: 2015-08-30, 16:48:39 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 901	Quote from: TinMan on 2015-08-30, 16:16:19 The cap will work as an AC cap,but the capacity is that great that the AC cycle would have to be very low,and the current flow very high.The one problem though is that the voltage capacity is very low-2.3 volts.We could of course join a few in series to get the voltage up,but i dont really see a use for such an AC cap of this size. But to have a super cap that can be charged in either direction would have it's benefit's. My goal now is to make a 20,000 farad cap the size of a AAA battery. I still think this is interesting and just the beginning! Wishing you success with your Utra-Cap build Luc

ion	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #441 on: 2015-08-30, 16:52:22 »
Group: Elite Hero Member Posts: 3537 It's turtles all the way down	Quote from: TinMan on 2015-08-30, 16:16:19 The cap will work as an AC cap,but the capacity is that great that the AC cycle would have to be very low,and the current flow very high.The one problem though is that the voltage capacity is very low-2.3 volts.We could of course join a few in series to get the voltage up,but i dont really see a use for such an AC cap of this size. But to have a super cap that can be charged in either direction would have it's benefit's. My goal now is to make a 20,000 farad cap the size of a AAA battery. What would further my interest in such devices would be if charge / discharge curves could be made such that the overall linearity of the capacitance versus voltage or current is apparent, among other factors. Dissipation factor and frequency response might also be useful, but not that important for bulk DC storage devices, but is for AC capacitors. It is good to have a goal that focuses on which parameter of the capacitor is deemed most important. If it is pure bulk capacitance you are after, remember that is only one factor that makes a capacitor interesting. Other factors would be effective series resistance, life cycle capability, aging without use( on the shelf ), aging with use, change of capacitance versus temperature, self discharge rate, dielectric absorption, peak current capability, to name just a very few. From the looks of it, it would seem your capacitor is a mesh equivalent of several R's and C's, plus some possible battery effects, hence it's apparent self recharge, It will take quite a bit of testing to identify the internal equivalent circuitry in your device. I serve at times as a consultant to this company: http://www.highenergycorp.com/ and can help you with some test procedures if you are interested. Nice start. Experimenting with chemical batteries / capacitors can be fun. --------------------------- "Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy

Slider2732	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #442 on: 2015-08-31, 03:16:52 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 1399 ... .-.. .. -.. . .-.	Over here, I can't wait for the next video...because of some weird ceiling of 0.4V ! No matter what i'm doing, charging with various cell structures is hitting that problem. Attached is a pic of the latest. Epsom salts, white vinegar and graphene. Zinc as electrodes. Same thing happens with galv steel as electrodes. The cell structure doesn't matter, because it doesn't work lol. But anyway, the graphene is in a suspension from a vid that RMS showed several months ago. It worked well when painted with a brush onto a CD and left to dry. Did a YouTube vid on that at the time. I've painted it onto a piece of packing plastic. Then a piece of a shamwow type thing was soaked in the electrolyte and 2 pieces of a CD are either side for rigidity (with foil removed via the packing tape method). Pressure is created by a 'papers holding squeezing thing' that i've clean forgotten the name of at the moment I think i've worked out the 'Tri' in Triphene. The graphene and the 2 electrodes. The charging action forms a carbon coating. All could well be completely wrong and seems to be At least it's practice at cell building and I now have a decent way to clamp a real one in the future. ------------------------ TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. IMAG0014.JPG (255.81 kB, 1024x768 - viewed 737 times.) --------------------------- ʎɐqǝ from pɹɐoqʎǝʞ a ʎnq ɹǝʌǝu

Slider2732	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #443 on: 2015-08-31, 06:31:33 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 1399 ... .-.. .. -.. . .-.	AHA! Thanks to Lidmotor and his latest video...stainless steel makes a big difference So, have to wonder if stainless features in the real deal. I have some IKEA Blanda Blanks, they are similar to Lidmotor's bowls, except magnetic. Same mixture and graphene painted on the lower one that is where the shamwow type of stuff sits. It puts out 1.2V and the current is 60mA start, fades off within about 3 seconds to 10mA, then sits there for a few seconds. Not bad, only on its 2nd charge yet, though I need to charge with something less powerful. On that note, the charger is an R/C plane type for NiCd and NiMH. Lowest current is 200mA and it quits if a resistor is used. In the pic below, you can see what happened to kitchen roll when charged like that ! burned it ! ------------------------ TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. IMAG0016.JPG (299.98 kB, 1024x768 - viewed 628 times.) --------------------------- ʎɐqǝ from pɹɐoqʎǝʞ a ʎnq ɹǝʌǝu

TinselKoala	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #444 on: 2015-08-31, 10:50:25 »
Group: Guest	I have to say that I am doubtful that these devices are actually functioning as capacitors. Capacitors store energy in the electric field produced by concentrated positive and negative charges separated by a dielectric. Bigger plate area + smaller separation = higher capacitance. I think the devices under consideration here, including Robert Murray-Smith's, are actually batteries, which are working by electrochemical interactions, ionic flows in electrolytes. I realize that there is some crossover between electrolytic capacitors, and batteries. Perhaps an examination of "ESR", equivalent series resistance, would help to clear up the matter.

ion	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #445 on: 2015-08-31, 13:21:28 »
Group: Elite Hero Member Posts: 3537 It's turtles all the way down	Quote from: TinselKoala on 2015-08-31, 10:50:25 I have to say that I am doubtful that these devices are actually functioning as capacitors. Capacitors store energy in the electric field produced by concentrated positive and negative charges separated by a dielectric. Bigger plate area + smaller separation = higher capacitance. I think the devices under consideration here, including Robert Murray-Smith's, are actually batteries, which are working by electrochemical interactions, ionic flows in electrolytes. I realize that there is some crossover between electrolytic capacitors, and batteries. Perhaps an examination of "ESR", equivalent series resistance, would help to clear up the matter. I would tend to agree. Also the recharging effect is easily modeled using two capacitors connected through a high resistance. The outside world sees one of the capacitors. Dielectric absorption models are similar. Add some electrolytes like vinegar and baking soda, and you are crossing over into battery land. Knowledge of the ingredients will shed more light on the electro chemistry involved. Lacking that, standard performance curves would reveal much. --------------------------- "Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy

TinMan	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #446 on: 2015-08-31, 14:15:02 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 4728	Quote from: TinselKoala on 2015-08-31, 10:50:25 I have to say that I am doubtful that these devices are actually functioning as capacitors. Capacitors store energy in the electric field produced by concentrated positive and negative charges separated by a dielectric. Bigger plate area + smaller separation = higher capacitance. I think the devices under consideration here, including Robert Murray-Smith's, are actually batteries, which are working by electrochemical interactions, ionic flows in electrolytes. I realize that there is some crossover between electrolytic capacitors, and batteries. Perhaps an examination of "ESR", equivalent series resistance, would help to clear up the matter. Two problems with that. 1-i am yet to see a battery that will accept a charge of either polarity. 2-i do use a dielectric material between the two plates-there is no conductivity between the two plates. --------------------------- Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

Slider2732	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #447 on: 2015-08-31, 18:33:52 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 1399 ... .-.. .. -.. . .-.	I'd like to apologise for being a ditz There have been quite some stresses at home over the past week or so and I clean forgot about the stainless steel mesh, plus other stated details. Nothing wrong with re-finding the details by trial and error, but if memory was working right, i'd not have needed to rediscover what had already been plainly spoken about in the Triphene videos !!!! Interesting second point there TinMan. The original way of making graphene was with a piece of tape. Being that tape itself would be a dielectric plastic layer, could that become a super-light method of creating the graphene layer ? and perhaps it is on both sides. Apologies if you've already stated as much LOL The stainless is that of fine mesh screen doors. Some time back, I got a sieve from Dollar Tree and intend to use that material. Perhaps another kitchen item to make a Triphene Shown below with English penny and USA quarter for mesh size. ------------------------ TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. IMAG0020.JPG (405.51 kB, 1024x768 - viewed 570 times.) « Last Edit: 2015-08-31, 19:04:56 by Slider2732 » --------------------------- ʎɐqǝ from pɹɐoqʎǝʞ a ʎnq ɹǝʌǝu

ion	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #448 on: 2015-08-31, 19:34:19 »
Group: Elite Hero Member Posts: 3537 It's turtles all the way down	Quote from: TinMan on 2015-08-31, 14:15:02 Two problems with that. 1-i am yet to see a battery that will accept a charge of either polarity. 2-i do use a dielectric material between the two plates-there is no conductivity between the two plates. Modern lead acid batteries are made with dissimilar lead plates, but will accept a reverse charge, just not as much, and probably not good for the life of the battery. If pure lead is used for both plates (like the original batteries), they can charge effectively in either direction. Google "lead acid reverse charge" for more info I suspect you have built a "pseudocapacitor" or "hybrid" capacitor Also see this on pseudocapacitors: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudocapacitor What is the dielectric material in your "capacitor"? « Last Edit: 2015-08-31, 22:14:49 by ION » --------------------------- "Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy

Grumage	Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #449 on: 2015-08-31, 21:03:36 »
Group: Renaissance Man Hero Member Posts: 2765	Dear Slider2372. It seems that the new craze of Vaping might just come to the rescue !! http://www.vape-atomizer-mesh.com/products/superfine_micron_mesh.html Really fine mesh at ridiculously low price !! Cheers Grum. --------------------------- Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

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