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OverUnity Research > Measurement Techniques and Equipment > Power Measurements > TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices.
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Author Topic: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices.  (Read 196371 times)
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img  gotoluc
Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #450 on: 2015-08-31, 22:14:32 »
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Here is also an Ultra Fine stainless steel mesh, down to 5 micron :o

https://utahbiodieselsupply.com/stainlessmesh.php

Luc

Look at the below images comparing 40 micron to 15 micron, so imagine 5 micron!
   
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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #451 on: 2015-08-31, 22:53:43 »
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Grum - Clicked the link and it said in bright red letters "Will not ship to USA"
 >:-)
Joking, relates to a post of yours recently.
A fascinating find ! might try that vaping thing just to get some of the mesh sheets. They often look like bongs to me, or some weirded out mini saxophone.

Luc - that is crazy !
My sieve idea seems to have holes in it.


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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #452 on: 2015-09-01, 00:16:23 »

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I would think any conductive material would do for the plates. I only used the S/S mesh as i thought the pockets would hold the graphene paste well. I will be trying solder soak(braided copper wire) as the two plates in my next video.

@ ION
I use a plastic cloth that i spray with silicon either side as my dielectric layer.


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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #453 on: 2015-09-01, 02:26:25 »
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Would this work ?



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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #454 on: 2015-09-01, 12:50:06 »

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Quote from: Slider2732 on 2015-08-31, 22:53:43

Luc - that is crazy !
My sieve idea seems to have holes in it.
You crack me up
   
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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #455 on: 2015-09-01, 17:37:26 »

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Quote from: TinselKoala on 2015-08-31, 10:50:25
I have to say that I am doubtful that these devices are actually functioning as capacitors. Capacitors store energy in the electric field produced by concentrated positive and negative charges separated by a dielectric. Bigger plate area + smaller separation = higher capacitance. I think the devices under consideration here, including Robert Murray-Smith's, are actually batteries, which are working by electrochemical interactions, ionic flows in electrolytes. I realize that there is some crossover between electrolytic capacitors, and batteries. Perhaps an examination of "ESR", equivalent series resistance, would help to clear up the matter.

Nope, Rob's are hybrids but don't use ionic conduction as such. He has created a way to create a huge surface area which utilises the double layer area to create the dielectric and so the huge capacitance.

Some of you will remember my copper coated carbon nano tubes, these deposited on two collector plates can make a hybrid, other ingredients are a separator and FeO3 (the iron oxide is the dielectric)

regards

Mike 8)




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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #456 on: 2015-09-01, 18:23:21 »
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Oh, good thinking FeO3 !
Yeah, my first try at this used deposits from an experiment of yours (years back now). Took the coating off with tape and then stuck it unstuck it 100 times.

The separator thing isn't working well here. If I use straight chemicals I get straight battery type results, albeit using similar metals.
Fun though, to go at it Edison style..knowing what doesn't work can be beneficial.
Along those lines, here's a fail lol
TinMan - you mentioned graphene paste and that intrigued me, also plastic cloth which I have no idea about.
The only thing I could think of to make a paste, was activated charcoal as the carbon, crush it up to a fine powder and that would mix with the liquid ingredients to form a paste. In the vids, it seems to be a black paste sure enough, but the granules wouldn't be graphene. Well, tried it anyway.
Epsom salts and water were used to simply try it out, piece of packing plastic and silicone as separator.
Result - 0.026V  :(
With a coffee filter and silicone as the separator, 0.560V that ran a blocking oscillator for about 10 seconds  :(
At least the cell looks more like one of the real ones  :D


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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #457 on: 2015-09-01, 18:50:31 »

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Mark

have you seen this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMLcWE6NLgM

regards

Mike 8)


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"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
Arthur Schopenhauer, Philosopher, 1788-1860

As a general rule, the most successful person in life is the person that has the best information.
   
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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #458 on: 2015-09-02, 01:07:50 »
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Hence squeezing probably works on the plates as a way to decrease the distance of separation, as well as to fully adhere reactive agents. 5:15 was interesting, about electrolytics and the construction, the use of oxides :)
See, that's where my graphene experiments normally fall over, graphitic oxide not translating to graphene. But, it would seem that graphitic oxide itself may be a player here on the stainless surface ?



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img  gotoluc
Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #459 on: 2015-09-30, 04:30:33 »
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Quote from: verpies on 2015-07-26, 10:45:38
A PWM module (or intermittent brush contact) interrupts the current flowing through the windings.  Such interruption of current always causes inductors to rebel and produce high voltage spike to maintain their current.  I do not want to call it a "flyback spike" because the current through the winding during that spike does not reverse direction.


Hi verpies and everyone else,

about a month ago I put together a test device to study what's goes on in a DC motor concerning coil on and off time.
I'm trying to see if we can do something advantageous with the so called "Flyback spike"
Please have a look at both videos and let me know what you think. All the test scope shots are below.

Test 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbFFJvbYHdk

Test 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH6QyLoewcw

Coil data: 1.1 Ohm DC Resistance and around 8mH Inductance

Does anyone see any advantages?  Thanks for your input

Luc
« Last Edit: 2015-09-30, 04:59:56 by gotoluc »
   
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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #460 on: 2015-09-30, 13:58:18 »

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Quote from: gotoluc on 2015-09-30, 04:30:33
Hi verpies and everyone else,

about a month ago I put together a test device to study what's goes on in a DC motor concerning coil on and off time.
I'm trying to see if we can do something advantageous with the so called "Flyback spike"
Please have a look at both videos and let me know what you think. All the test scope shots are below.

Test 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbFFJvbYHdk

Test 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH6QyLoewcw

Coil data: 1.1 Ohm DC Resistance and around 8mH Inductance

Does anyone see any advantages?  Thanks for your input

Luc

Hi Luc
Nice test.

When you add the diode,you are creating a current loop through the inductor. This allows the magnetic field to be maintained longer around the inductor than it would be if the inductor became open circuit-no diode to create the current loop. So without the diode,the coil becomes open,and the magnetic field collapses as soon as the current source(batteries) is disconected,where if the diode is in play,that current can continue to circulate around the coil until the voltage drop's to the value of the voltage drop across your diode-->this is why you see an abrupt stop at about . 6 volts to the current flow. Also note that you have your diode so as it is with the current flow,not against it,as the current will continue to flow in the same direction through the inductor when the power is disconnected from the inductor(pulse from batteries finishes). Only the voltage inverts when the P/in is disconnected-as can be seen on your scope shots.

Also,in regard to using a higher voltage and lower current.
With a set inductor,the current will rise as you raise the voltage. A couple of ways to lower the current is by either increasing the set resistance of the coil of the inductor,or increasing the frequency(by quite a lot) of the pulses sent to the inductor until the skin effect starts to take place. This is much like reducing the size of the wire the current is flowing through,as the skin depth of the conductor(wire) the current flows through become's less with the increase of frequency-->but this is at high frequencies.


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img  gotoluc
Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #461 on: 2015-09-30, 14:45:24 »
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Quote from: TinMan on 2015-09-30, 13:58:18
Hi Luc
Nice test.

When you add the diode,you are creating a current loop through the inductor. This allows the magnetic field to be maintained longer around the inductor than it would be if the inductor became open circuit-no diode to create the current loop. So without the diode,the coil becomes open,and the magnetic field collapses as soon as the current source(batteries) is disconected,where if the diode is in play,that current can continue to circulate around the coil until the voltage drop's to the value of the voltage drop across your diode-->this is why you see an abrupt stop at about . 6 volts to the current flow.

Is this what the diode is doing in your RT?

Quote from: TinMan on 2015-09-30, 13:58:18
Also note that you have your diode so as it is with the current flow,not against it,as the current will continue to flow in the same direction through the inductor when the power is disconnected from the inductor(pulse from batteries finishes). Only the voltage inverts when the P/in is disconnected-as can be seen on your scope shots.

I have a little trouble understanding this part. The way I see it is, the initial pulse current cannot enter the diode, if it did, would the pulse not be short circuited?... to me it looks like the diode only comes at play when the input pulse ends (switch opens) and the coil wants to dump the voltage which is now going in the opposite direction as the initial pulse but now the diode open and sends it back in the coil to loop till the coils resistance burns it up, which in exchange may be what holds the current?
That's the way I see it and if you see it differently I would be very open to a more detailed explanation.


Quote from: TinMan on 2015-09-30, 13:58:18
Also,in regard to using a higher voltage and lower current.
With a set inductor,the current will rise as you raise the voltage. A couple of ways to lower the current is by either increasing the set resistance of the coil of the inductor,or increasing the frequency(by quite a lot) of the pulses sent to the inductor until the skin effect starts to take place. This is much like reducing the size of the wire the current is flowing through,as the skin depth of the conductor(wire) the current flows through become's less with the increase of frequency-->but this is at high frequencies.

At what frequencies would this effect start and can pulsed DC be considered to do this?

Thanks for sharing

Luc
   
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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #462 on: 2015-09-30, 15:36:29 »

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Quote from: gotoluc on 2015-09-30, 14:45:24


Thanks for sharing

Luc

Quote
At what frequencies would this effect start and can pulsed DC be considered to do this?

http://www.belden.com/blog/broadcastav/understanding-skin-effect-and-frequency.cfm

Quote
Is this what the diode is doing in your RT?

No.

Quote
I have a little trouble understanding this part. The way I see it is, the initial pulse current cannot enter the diode, if it did, would the pulse not be short circuited?... to me it looks like the diode only comes at play when the input pulse ends (switch opens)
Quote
and the coil wants to dump the voltage which is now going in the opposite direction
as the initial pulse but now the diode open and sends it back in the coil to loop till the coils resistance burns it up, which in exchange may be what holds the current?
That's the way I see it and if you see it differently I would be very open to a more detailed explanation.

The diode allows the current to continue to flow around the inductor(the loop),so the diode is in the direction of current flow,but blocks current from flowing in the opposited direction. The voltage invert's because the magnetic field is now collapsing in stead of expanding around the inductor when the current source(batteries)is disconnected. In the pic below,the red arrows show current flow around the conducting wire when the batteries are the current source,and the red plus and minus signs show voltage polarity-the magnetic field around the inductor is expanding(being built). The blue arrows show current flow when the batteries are disconnected,and the collapsing magnetic field becomes the energy source that causes the current to continue to flow. But now because the magnetic field is collapsing in stead of expanding,the voltage polarity is inverted-shown by the blue plus and minus signs in the pic.-->Remember,it is current that flow's-voltage is only a potential difference needed for current flow.


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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #463 on: 2015-10-01, 15:08:16 »

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One of the booby traps in the modern teaching on electromagnetics is the minus sign when dealing with back emf, such as V=Minus L*di/dt or V=Minus dPhi/dt.  And that minus sign comes about because of where the voltage is coming from, i.e. is it forward voltage (as in applied voltage from a battery trying to drive inward current) or is it backward voltage (trying to drive current coming back out toward the battery)?  The minus sign is merely an indication of that backward polarity.  By that reasoning we should use Ohm's law as V=Minus i*R but convention has called that V "voltage drop" and we don't have the minus sign there.  It is that disparity that is the reason we have the minus sign in V=Minus L*di/dt but we don't have a minus sign in the AC version V=i*wL.  The AC voltage across the reactance wL is treated as a "voltage drop" whereas the transient voltage voltage from di/dt isn't.  If we think of back emf having the polarity of "voltage drop" perhaps the confusion is removed.

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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #464 on: 2015-10-12, 16:30:34 »
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Hey Tinman
Quote
The diode allows the current to continue to flow around the inductor(the loop),so the diode is in the direction of current flow,but blocks current from flowing in the opposited direction. The voltage invert's because the magnetic field is now collapsing in stead of expanding around the inductor when the current source(batteries)is disconnected. In the pic below,the red arrows show current flow around the conducting wire when the batteries are the current source,and the red plus and minus signs show voltage polarity-the magnetic field around the inductor is expanding(being built). The blue arrows show current flow when the batteries are disconnected,and the collapsing magnetic field becomes the energy source that causes the current to continue to flow. But now because the magnetic field is collapsing in stead of expanding,the voltage polarity is inverted-shown by the blue plus and minus signs in the pic.-->Remember,it is current that flow's-voltage is only a potential difference needed for current flow.

That is a good explanation, fundamentally a magnetic field may only expand into another region or contract from it. The physical analogy for Gotoluc's circuit is an air turbine with a cross tube and check valve (the diode). The air source applied pressure/flow spins the turbine and the applied pressure holds the check valve closed. When we remove the air source the turbine generates it's own pressure seen as reversed relative to the applied source however the flow remains in the same direction through the check valve.

This is why Tesla often referred to the property of inductance as electrical inertia. Here is an excellent article where the author makes direct comparisons between physical and electrical properties--http://rexresearch.com/bellocq/bellocq.htm. I love this old school stuff because Bellocq explains the properties in very simple terms which are easy to understand.

Many might not get this but Bellocq describes a system to raise water against the force of gravity in a different way using a fraction of the power normally required. Then he goes on to describe how the properties of his water pumping system are just like that of an electrical circuit. Uhm... it shouldn't take a rocket scientist to put two and two together. Note the applied source of pressure is at the top of the well not the bottom and the water flow moves towards the source not away from it?.

AC


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Re: TinMans reserch and experiments into free energy devices. « Reply #465 on: 2015-10-12, 17:50:07 »

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Quote from: Allcanadian on 2015-10-12, 16:30:34
Note the applied source of pressure is at the top of the well not the bottom and the water flow moves towards the source not away from it?.

AC

The system is resonant within the specific gravity field.

The well top is open to atmospheric pressure (air gas pressing down on liquid column [weight force]).

The compressor piston reciprocating in the Toribio BELLOCQ Wave Pump is pumping the atmosphere.. in a closed pneumatic / hydraulic loop..

http://rexresearch.com/bellocq/bellocq.htm#1730337a

"This system would seem contrary to the laws of gravity, which does not permit of liquid being elevated or drawn up from a depth greater than the length of a column of the same liquid counter-balancing the atmospheric pressure; however, in fact there is employed a force which travels throughout the pipe and arrives at the lower valve VI. This force operates at this valve in the same manner as if there were a piston at this point.

The present system would also seem to be contrary to the law which does not permit a piston of a given displacement to obtain at each stroke a volume of liquid greater than such displacement; but it will be apparent that a piston of a given displacement, under a given pressure, may obtain at each stroke a liquid volume several times greater than the volume of displacement of such piston, but under a pressure several times less. "

hhop gen 3 introduces liquid gas phase transition and therefore exploits the magnitudes volume differential between a liquid and a gas, doing work in the process.


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