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OverUnity Research > Electrical / Electronic Devices > Tariel Kapanadze's Devices (Moderators: verpies, Apecore) > Akula0083 Lantern v3
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Author Topic: Akula0083 Lantern v3  (Read 101660 times)
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img  Groundloop
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #25 on: 2014-05-01, 18:46:36 »
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Quote from: TutorialFE on 2014-05-01, 13:58:05
@All

I've assembled the circuit with my little experience of electronic and wanted more information if anyone could help me ...

Question:

- The potentiometers are linear or logarithmic?

-  Capacitors 3nF must be ceramic?

- Seems to me that Akula has put a big ceramic capacitor in the device but in my scheme is missing.....

Thank who answer my question...





TutorialFE,

You can use LIN pot-meters.
Can be any capacitor type, ceramic or foil.
It is not a capacitor, it is a NTC resistor for over-voltage protection.

GL.
   
img  ion
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #26 on: 2014-05-01, 20:28:02 »
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It's turtles all the way down
Negative Temperature Coefficient resistors do not provide overvoltage protection, they are a class of thermistors that decrease resistance with increasing temperature. This would obviously cause a self destruction of the NTC thermistor or the circuit itself.

PTC thermistors increase resistance with temperature, again no protection here unless it is in series with the device you are trying to protect. These only limit current but must be sized properly or will also self destruct.

I think you mean bulk metal oxide varistor otherwise known as MOV that have a soft conduction knee for circuits like a bidirectional zener. They can safely absorb and dissipate a certain number of Joules above their voltage clamp rating. These look like large ceramic capacitors.

As far as capacitors go, film type will be more stable than ceramics with temperature unless they are the class NPO type. Film types will also have less leakage and be more stable in timing circuits. Ceramics are mostly used for bypass except for a few types that offer a specified drift value that usually offsets the drift of some other component to null out the temperature susceptibility.

I agree, linear pots seem to work quite well with the TL494. I prefer to use multiturn types to have finer resolution of parameter setting, especially since in the Akula designs you are trying to hit a very narrow window of frequency and duty cycle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varistor

http://www.learningaboutelectronics.com/Articles/What-is-a-NPO-ceramic-capacitor


---------------------------
"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  MenofFather
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #27 on: 2014-05-01, 20:35:23 »
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Quote from: TutorialFE on 2014-05-01, 13:58:05
@All

I've assembled the circuit with my little experience of electronic and wanted more information if anyone could help me ...

Question:

- The potentiometers are linear or logarithmic?

-  Capacitors 3nF must be ceramic?

- Seems to me that Akula has put a big ceramic capacitor in the device but in my scheme is missing.....

Thank who answer my question...




3nF ceramic or other, but not electrlitical.
"- The potentiometers are linear or logarithmic?"
Here is simple potentiometers, in other words are variable resistors.
   
img  Groundloop
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #28 on: 2014-05-01, 21:35:21 »
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Quote from: ION on 2014-05-01, 20:28:02
Negative Temperature Coefficient resistors do not provide overvoltage protection, they are a class of thermistors that decrease resistance with increasing temperature. This would obviously cause a self destruction of the NTC thermistor or the circuit itself.

PTC thermistors increase resistance with temperature, again no protection here unless it is in series with the device you are trying to protect. These only limit current but must be sized properly or will also self destruct.

I think you mean bulk metal oxide varistor otherwise known as MOV that have a soft conduction knee for circuits like a bidirectional zener. They can safely absorb and dissipate a certain number of Joules above their voltage clamp rating. These look like large ceramic capacitors.

As far as capacitors go, film type will be more stable than ceramics with temperature unless they are the class NPO type. Film types will also have less leakage and be more stable in timing circuits. Ceramics are mostly used for bypass except for a few types that offer a specified drift value that usually offsets the drift of some other component to null out the temperature susceptibility.

I agree, linear pots seem to work quite well with the TL494. I prefer to use multiturn types to have finer resolution of parameter setting, especially since in the Akula designs you are trying to hit a very narrow window of frequency and duty cycle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varistor

http://www.learningaboutelectronics.com/Articles/What-is-a-NPO-ceramic-capacitor

ION,

The hand draw circuit had a Thermistors symbol. I did not find FNR 109 on the web.
I agree that it can be a MOV. But I think the main purpose the designer had was to
snub the high voltage spikes from the coil to protect the MOSFET from high voltage.

http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2420.0;attach=13199;image

GL.
   
img  ion
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #29 on: 2014-05-01, 22:38:05 »
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It's turtles all the way down
Quote from: Groundloop on 2014-05-01, 21:35:21
ION,

The hand draw circuit had a Thermistors symbol. I did not find FNR 109 on the web.
I agree that it can be a MOV. But I think the main purpose the designer had was to
snub the high voltage spikes from the coil to protect the MOSFET from high voltage.

http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2420.0;attach=13199;image

GL.

Agreed, it could also be a TVS or transient voltage suppressor diode, but he did not use that symbol either.

Countries do differ in their symbols on the more exotic devices.


---------------------------
"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  Peterae
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #30 on: 2014-05-02, 07:34:24 »

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Buy me some coffee
I think the upside down Ohm sign is a clue, maybe some sort of start up bias applied across the core? maybe the core needs to be hot to work and this heats it up on power up.

Mho is an alternative name of the same unit, the reciprocal of one ohm. Mho is derived from spelling ohm backwards and is written with an upside-down capital Greek letter Omega: \mho, Unicode symbol U+2127 (℧). According to Maver[3] the term mho was suggested by Sir William Thomson (Lord Kelvin). The mho was officially renamed to the siemens, replacing the old meaning of the "siemens unit", at a conference in 1881.[4]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siemens_%28unit%29
« Last Edit: 2014-05-02, 09:58:19 by Peterae »
   
img  stprue
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #31 on: 2014-05-02, 13:30:19 »

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Great progress happening here but I think we should start off of a basic concept like this http://laserhacker.com/?p=401
LS is the only person that has come close to any sort of similar effects.  Here is his most recent video if you haven't seen it already.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dq9NQhzdw0&list=UUIKzUKkh7XtnSYPW0AJb-9w
   
img  TutorialFE
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #32 on: 2014-05-02, 15:15:20 »
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@All

Good news...

I've probably figured out the thickness of the wires for an Akula Lantern 3

this is not a game I begin to think that there are too many coincidences to be a fake ...

I found the cables also the ferrite ......  things quite difficult to find but the nice that match the number of turn on ferrite shown in the diagram with the wires that I've found around....

so if it were a real game some things would not go back ..

I've put the pictures of possible ways to build the cable with copper wires for large electric motors and electric wires with shrink wrap for multi-layer to build the thickness of the plastic part isolant

Below my discover....

@GL-MenF

Thanks for answering ...
I understand that a NTC ...I've seen so many on the boards of television that I'm using for finding free components ... if NTC  serves as a component where I have to put in the circuit of the Lantern 3 which values?
« Last Edit: 2014-05-02, 16:20:25 by TutorialFE »
   
img  Groundloop
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #33 on: 2014-05-02, 19:39:00 »
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Quote from: TutorialFE on 2014-05-02, 15:15:20
@All

Good news...

I've probably figured out the thickness of the wires for an Akula Lantern 3

this is not a game I begin to think that there are too many coincidences to be a fake ...

I found the cables also the ferrite ......  things quite difficult to find but the nice that match the number of turn on ferrite shown in the diagram with the wires that I've found around....

so if it were a real game some things would not go back ..

I've put the pictures of possible ways to build the cable with copper wires for large electric motors and electric wires with shrink wrap for multi-layer to build the thickness of the plastic part isolant

Below my discover....

@GL-MenF

Thanks for answering ...
I understand that a NTC ...I've seen so many on the boards of television that I'm using for finding free components ... if NTC  serves as a component where I have to put in the circuit of the Lantern 3 which values?

TutorialFE,

It is very hard to say. The symbol on the drawing was for a Thermistor and the upside down Ohm symbol may indicate
a negative Thermistor. This may indicate a NTC component. I did a search on the Internet for the FNR 109, but could not find any.
So your guess work is as good as mine. Now, if the designers intent was to protect the MOSFET for over voltage,
then I would use any over voltage component that was rated a bit lower in voltage than the maximum voltage the MOSFET
can handle. But then again, the blue component can be anything, only Akyla knows.

GL.
« Last Edit: 2014-05-03, 04:28:50 by Groundloop »
   
img  TutorialFE
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #34 on: 2014-05-03, 13:51:24 »
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@ All

I finished assembling the whole thing ...
I followed the scheme with the diodes UF4007 ...
For the pots I found those from 22k to 20k and I have not founf them... according to the parameters of another
scheme that with the signs in Russian F1 at 14K Q1  0-50% of the possibility of adjusting the U-OUT (10K) to find the
adjustment ..

the other F1 to 16.6K.. Q1 to adjust from 0 to 95% ... (I've turned the pot to the right and the left, and change the intensity of light LEDs increasing ...or diminuend )

The values on the scheme take with multimeter from the center of the pot to the negative I hope is right... and not viceversa
 
Who could confirm that this was the right setting?

I tried turning on the LEDs come on but when the pull out the battery everything switch off ...

What could I do to understand the regulation of the 3 other pot... ??

The wire of the telephone is very strong to bend instead the neon wire is soft...( but i don't have a long wire)  maybe could be also a problem that ?

Hope somebody answer also Akula0083 if he's online.....and seen the forum...
« Last Edit: 2014-05-03, 17:32:49 by TutorialFE »
   
img  4Tesla
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #35 on: 2014-05-03, 20:57:53 »
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Quote from: stprue on 2014-05-02, 13:30:19
Great progress happening here but I think we should start off of a basic concept like this http://laserhacker.com/?p=401
LS is the only person that has come close to any sort of similar effects.  Here is his most recent video if you haven't seen it already.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dq9NQhzdw0&list=UUIKzUKkh7XtnSYPW0AJb-9w

Looks like LS successfully replicated the 3v flashlight.. but using a simplified 9v circuit and about 10 min run time.. probably the same run time as others, but they don't tell you that part.

http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/
 
   
img  4Tesla
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #36 on: 2014-05-03, 21:03:11 »
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@TutorialFE

Nice work on your build!  Sorry I can't answer the your questions.  I hope you get it self running!  Thanks for keeping us updated.  O0
   
img  ion
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #37 on: 2014-05-03, 23:44:20 »
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It's turtles all the way down
TutorialFE said:

Quote
The wire of the telephone is very strong to bend instead the neon wire is soft...( but i don't have a long wire)  maybe could be also a problem that ?

Some telephone wire is copper clad steel, typically the type that goes from the pole to your house. Copper clad steel is cheaper and stronger than pure copper, but is magnetic and will affect the operation by introducing eddy current losses in the steel part.

You might want to check your wire with a magnet.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My circuit is built up and the transformer wound and connected. I am taking a slightly different approach and not trying to light any LED's, rather I am allowing 100% of the output of the 19 turn winding to bootstrap the power input using a Schottky diode.

My reasoning is that it will be easier to find the sweet spot without trying to drag the load of the LEDs along with the other circuit quiescent burdens.

I am supplying 9 volts input from a power supply (through a decoupling diode) and am watching the current as I tune, the idea being to find a sudden dip in the current drain, which is typically around 10 mA. So the circuit completely bootstrapped draws around 90 mW at one setting of the pots.

If the sweet spot is found the voltage should soar beyond the 9 volt input setting and the voltage shutdown potentiometer is set to shut the circuit down at 10 volts. If the sweet spot is found, the oscillator circuit will then be "gated" as it cycles around the voltage limit.

I am also watching the waveforms as I tune.

With such a broad range of tuning, and so many parameters to tune it is like trying to find a needle in the haystack. It would be helpful to know the approximate center frequency and duty cycle for each oscillator in an attempt to narrow the tuning range, but I know this will differ for each ferrite used.

Note that the transformer phasing dots on the hand drawn schematic are not shown on the later "cleaned up" schematics.



---------------------------
"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  4Tesla
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #38 on: 2014-05-04, 02:49:49 »
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@ION

Thanks for the update!  O0
   
img  MenofFather
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #39 on: 2014-05-04, 09:10:21 »
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Quote from: TutorialFE on 2014-05-03, 13:51:24
@ All

I finished assembling the whole thing ...
I followed the scheme with the diodes UF4007 ...
For the pots I found those from 22k to 20k and I have not founf them... according to the parameters of another
scheme that with the signs in Russian F1 at 14K Q1  0-50% of the possibility of adjusting the U-OUT (10K) to find the
adjustment ..

the other F1 to 16.6K.. Q1 to adjust from 0 to 95% ... (I've turned the pot to the right and the left, and change the intensity of light LEDs increasing ...or diminuend )

The values on the scheme take with multimeter from the center of the pot to the negative I hope is right... and not viceversa
 
Who could confirm that this was the right setting?

I tried turning on the LEDs come on but when the pull out the battery everything switch off ...

What could I do to understand the regulation of the 3 other pot... ??

The wire of the telephone is very strong to bend instead the neon wire is soft...( but i don't have a long wire)  maybe could be also a problem that ?

Hope somebody answer also Akula0083 if he's online.....and seen the forum...
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2420.0;attach=13330
This schematic is wrong, here no sinchronisation betwenn two TL494 generators, I ask question for Akula if no be sinchronization, then it works? He say, that not works. Something like this be my and he words.  :)

"Note that the transformer phasing dots on the hand drawn schematic are not shown on the later "cleaned up" schematics."
About dots. I see video and in video all two beginings let say of windings conected together and conected to plus, one other end conected to drain one mosfet, other end coected to drain other mosfet. :)
   
img  Groundloop
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #40 on: 2014-05-04, 11:25:14 »
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Quote from: MenofFather on 2014-05-04, 09:10:21
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2420.0;attach=13330
This schematic is wrong, here no sinchronisation betwenn two TL494 generators, I ask question for Akula if no be sinchronization, then it works? He say, that not works. Something like this be my and he words.  :)

"Note that the transformer phasing dots on the hand drawn schematic are not shown on the later "cleaned up" schematics."
About dots. I see video and in video all two beginings let say of windings conected together and conected to plus, one other end conected to drain one mosfet, other end coected to drain other mosfet. :)

MenofFather,

Why not ask Akula for the correct circuit drawing then?
With ALL information provided and correct core and coil data.
With correct measurements and o-scope data.

GL.
   
img  4Tesla
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #41 on: 2014-05-04, 16:27:11 »
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Quote from: Groundloop on 2014-05-04, 11:25:14
MenofFather,

Why not ask Akula for the correct circuit drawing then?
With ALL information provided and correct core and coil data.
With correct measurements and o-scope data.

GL.

After he made that video, you would think the best proof that his device works is for others to get working replicas.  That would be so much easier with a schematic from him.
   
img  TutorialFE
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #42 on: 2014-05-05, 00:44:44 »
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Quote from: ION on 2014-05-03, 23:44:20


@ION You might want to check your wire with a magnet.


I checked the copper wire phone with a permanent  magnet from hard disk and there 'no attraction ... It's will probably more strong because it will not be 100% copper.

I did a comparison of the hardness and telephone pylons of 1 mm thickness is harder than what I have of the old houses from 1.25 thickness..

so I think it is not good for the windings as it does not fit well to the shape of the ferrite ...

I will replace it with 0.75mm enamelled copper wire that I removed from a vacuum cleaner 1000w motor.. thicness isolated with the shrink that I posted pictures that are 1 meter long

Then not having the oscilloscope will try to see what happens when you put a compass near ferrite turn potentiometers ....

If I'll have to examine or modify the circuit with the oscilloscope there will be problems in some way I will try to do everything to made woking the circuit....

Thanks to all
   
img  4Tesla
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #43 on: 2014-05-05, 03:02:44 »
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Quote from: TutorialFE on 2014-05-05, 00:44:44
Then not having the oscilloscope will try to see what happens when you put a compass near ferrite turn potentiometers ....

Hi!  If you need an oscilloscope for less than 1Mhz then you can get one for less than $70US.  Of course you can get higher bandwidth but will cost more.
Just wasn't sure if you knew how low they start at.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0U008M6442&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleMKP&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleMKP-_-pla-_-Measuring+Tools-_-9SIA0U008M6442&ef_id=UvmTBwAABee@GmY0:20140505015726:s
   
img  TutorialFE
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #44 on: 2014-05-05, 16:27:32 »
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Quote from: 4Tesla on 2014-05-05, 03:02:44
Hi!  If you need an oscilloscope for less than 1Mhz then you can get one for less than $70US.  Of course you can get higher bandwidth but will cost more.
Just wasn't sure if you knew how low they start at.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0U008M6442&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleMKP&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleMKP-_-pla-_-Measuring+Tools-_-9SIA0U008M6442&ef_id=UvmTBwAABee@GmY0:20140505015726:s

Thanks,

I've already had some indication from Grum ...

The point for me that I do not have much money to invest in researching... as I understand  in home device ... It must have a lot of knowledge ... recover pieces that do not are produce anymore .... have a good equipment for the various measurements such as those of Akula ...

it seems that he still saving money but to the instrumentation did not think much and it comes with several oscilloscopes and frequency generators ...

from my point of view it would cost much less if the partial winding resonance it would put a person at Akula knowledge and sent after payment of the windings with ferrite

 then each one who receives the winding does the electronic circuit and puts everything in function ... so there would be no need for anyone to buy all of the laboratory equipment ...

I think a team group would be easier...
   
img  MenofFather
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #45 on: 2014-05-05, 17:39:38 »
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Quote from: Groundloop on 2014-05-04, 11:25:14
MenofFather,

Why not ask Akula for the correct circuit drawing then?
With ALL information provided and correct core and coil data.
With correct measurements and o-scope data.

GL.
I ask him or he can give circiut of 1 W divice. He say, that he not give circuit.
   
img  ion
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #46 on: 2014-05-05, 18:00:45 »
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It's turtles all the way down
Quote from: MenofFather on 2014-05-05, 17:39:38
I ask him or he can give circiut of 1 W divice. He say, that he not give circuit.

Well that is an interesting reply that can lead one to several conclusions:

1) He has a working circuit, but does not wish to give it for whatever reasons (other business associations, loss of the spotlight, youtube hit counter, etc.)

2) He does not have a working circuit, therefore cannot give what he does not have.

In the progression of invention, we see engineers go from bench type proof of concept devices,  then scale up to usable devices that benefit mankind.

In the Akula devices, it is all over the place, but no scaling upward, no steady progression and improvement,  in fact some of the latest, more viable units seem to go back down in scale and power output.

I cannot guess what they are but believe there may be other factors at play here. I will say that non of this behavior fits true open source activity, but then he never really joined the club.


---------------------------
"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  TutorialFE
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #47 on: 2014-05-05, 19:40:25 »
Group: Guest
@All

Good news something happen...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zg3txfwU9o
   
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Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #48 on: 2014-05-05, 20:59:49 »
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img  ion
Re: Akula0083 Lantern v3 « Reply #49 on: 2014-05-05, 21:19:59 »
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It's turtles all the way down
Quote from: MenofFather on 2014-05-05, 17:39:38
I ask him or he can give circiut of 1 W divice. He say, that he not give circuit.

That's Ok, we should be smart enough to experiment on our own.

Personally I'm a bit tired of having crumb droppers dangle pieces at us then holding back. Seems to be the MO of just about every project we have been involved in.

We have a reasonably good starting point. We have some good minds to hypothesize and test from here.

 Even if he was faking it, the idea of hitting some anomalous activity in a ferrite containing MnZn via either NMR or NAR is worthy of experiment. Some of us have been seriously considering this via other channels.


---------------------------
"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
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