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OverUnity Research > Benches > Grumage (Moderator: Grumage) > Akula0083 30 watt self running generator.
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Author Topic: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator.  (Read 975007 times)
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img  Peterae
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #175 on: 2014-03-21, 19:54:19 »

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Buy me some coffee
@Grumage
Quote
Was that for me ??
Just a comment that came to me while watching the video.

for instance, if we say use a 100Watt bulb and we know the current I=35.5A then V=P/I

Bulb Wattage    Bulb Voltage
100W               2.82V
50W                 1.408v
10W                 282mV

So it takes a bulb voltage rating of 2.82V to light a 100 Watt bulb to the brightness in the vid when 35.5 amps current are flowing

I've never heard of a 282mV 10 Watt bulb

So there's something fishy going on.

@Lost_bro
OK Thanks that's interesting then  O0
   
img  Itsu
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #176 on: 2014-03-21, 20:05:59 »

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Received my gapless core today (2 days, super fast), see picture.
With the gapped one i now can make severall combinations of gaps.

The gapless one measures like this:

L1 500uH
L2 7mH

Now of to build the control circuit.......

Regards Itsu
   
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Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #177 on: 2014-03-21, 20:09:07 »

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Nice one Itsu  ;)
   
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Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #178 on: 2014-03-21, 20:40:44 »

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Dear Itsu and all.

A very nice transformer and almost identical inductances to mine !! O0

Please see attached screenshot from the recent Russian video I posted.

Comments ??

Cheers Grum.


---------------------------
Nanny state ? Left at the gate !! :)
   
img  Matt Watts
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #179 on: 2014-03-21, 20:41:30 »
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I can't explain this hunch, so I'll just show it.  Something about that little RC circuit tells me it's there to slightly offset the phase between the primary and secondary.  And a phase offset could be the key to the resonance or a way to match any transformer you hook up.
   
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Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #180 on: 2014-03-21, 20:48:28 »

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Quote from: Matt Watts on 2014-03-21, 20:41:30
I can't explain this hunch, so I'll just show it.  Something about that little RC circuit tells me it's there to slightly offset the phase between the primary and secondary.  And a phase offset could be the key to the resonance or a way to match any transformer you hook up.

Dear Matt.

T-1000 made a strong reference to that "LITTLE" corner !!  ;)

Glad you brought it up !!

Cheers Grum.


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Nanny state ? Left at the gate !! :)
   
img  lost_bro
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #181 on: 2014-03-21, 21:27:27 »
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Quote from: Grumage on 2014-03-21, 18:45:18
Dear All.

I wold first like to welcome,  From other Planet and lost_bro.  Consider yourselves "poached" !!  O0

T-1000 shared this video via Skype to Itsu and myself last night. Please enjoy !!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afPQtDbn_3s

You will note that the transformer is a pair of TV yoke cores and the driver is a Push Pull style with frequency controller chip.  Ah La GeoFusion !!  "Say no more " Nod Nod Wink Wink...........  Sorry I grew up with Monty Python !!  ;D

I think the point I am trying to make here is that it does not matter what  form the drive takes, it's the way the transformer is configured !!

T-1000 is convinced that we are looking at a Parallel input resonance and a Series output resonance and the above video is achieving this at around 14 KHz!!

Comments??

Cheers Grum.

Good Day Grum, thanks for the invitation to be part of the 'Group'.

OK,  funny thing you should mention the Frequency controller chip.   
The TL494CN is a PWM controller chip.  It regulates via feedback thru the error amps to control Pulse width of the signal, not the frequency of signal.
I thought this was strange from the start because the only frequency regulation on the schematic is from potentiometer R15. 
This adjustment is NOT automatic ( as the error amps only control Pulse width) so this Chip will NOT track frequency, if that was the original idea.
From my experience..... the frequency will drift with temp. change of the circuit.....  and I would assume that the operating frequency  IS critical to the workings of the circuit.

Do you know which chip is used in the video?

Take care, peace.
lost_bro
   
img  NerzhDishual
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #182 on: 2014-03-21, 22:16:22 »
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Hi Gentlemen,

My 2 cents... Once again this clapped-out old drivelling French guy?   :-X
Yes!   :-[

IMO:
- In the Shark (акула/Akula)'s device, the secret is in the transformer.
Of course, it is very usefull to have the "driving circuit".

- But, if we do not understand what is going on in this apparatus
the likelihoods of success are very weak. R they not?

So, post like the Matt Watts's one about Andrei Melnichenko and this
Transgeneration_Discovery.pdf could be of great help.

Should I also quote:
Quote from: T-1000 on 2014-03-18, 20:53:31
Hi,As I mentioned before, the secret is in way transformer is made, not in electronics.
............

And

Quote from: lost_bro on 2014-03-21, 19:40:32
..........
I know that the secret to this IS in the coil configuration, just as the work
of Stanley Meyers was and is the secret of the coil configurations.
..........

For my part, I keep on thinking that:
- The  Akula's "transformer" is more than a mere transformer.
- The Kapanadze "coil(s)" is/are more than (a) mere coil(s).

Now, 2 pictures:
1) This one:




2) The modified MenofFather's picture from OU dot com (already quoted here)
http://www.overunity.com/14378/akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator/msg393505/#msg393505



------------------
    If (Voltage across a Capacitor)
        Then
          If (Variable Voltage)
            Then       
              variable electric field
              Variable magnetic field at right angle
          end if
        else
           Va revr gant al laboused bihan, me zo 'vont d'ar gêr   ;D
    end if   
--------
Cheers,
Jean

   
 
   
   
img  lost_bro
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #183 on: 2014-03-21, 22:39:43 »
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Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-03-21, 22:16:22

IMO:
- In the Shark (акула/Akula)'s device, the secret is in the transformer.
Of course, it is very usefull to have the "driving circuit".

- But, if we do not understand what is going on in this apparatus
the likelihoods of success are very weak. R they not?

So, post like the Matt Watts's one about Andrei Melnichenko and this
Transgeneration_Discovery.pdf could be of great help.

Should I also quote:
And

For my part, I keep on thinking that:
- The  Akula's "transformer" is more than a mere transformer.
- The Kapanadze "coil(s)" is/are more than (a) mere coil(s).

Now, 2 pictures:
1) This one:




2) The modified MenofFather's picture from OU dot com (already quoted here)
http://www.overunity.com/14378/akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator/msg393505/#msg393505



------------------
    If (Voltage across a Capacitor)
        Then
          If (Variable Voltage)
            Then      
              variable electric field
              Variable magnetic field at right angle
          end if
        else
           Va revr gant al laboused bihan, me zo 'vont d'ar gêr   ;D
    end if    
--------
Cheers,
Jean

  
  
  

Hello Jean

Yes, I remember from my days of pursuing the S.M. HHO experiments that Stanley Meyers talked about 'distributed Capacitance' in his bifilar coils used in his patents.
He apparently used it to his benefit.

Tesla always talked about reducing 'distributed capacitance as if it were the enemy.  He shows many different ways to add capacitors across his coil configurations to eliminate his version of distributed capacitance.

Yes, we are dealing with something very different here.

take care, peace.
lost_bro
   
img  NerzhDishual
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #184 on: 2014-03-22, 00:22:21 »
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Hi Lost_Bro,

Thank you for your comment. I was talking about "purposely" added capacitance.
Actually, I had forgotten to post this picture:




-------------------

According that, in an AC circuit, a capacitance (and/or a coil) does not consume (and produce) nothing.
Notably: take a "tank circuit" (parallel resonance).
Seen from the source, it has an huge impedance. It behaves like an almost open circuit.
So, very few power is consumed from the source.
But, in this tank circuit, amperes are circulating.
Unfortunately, these amperes are considered as useless.
Fortunately, some witty guys (not me!) had the idea of designing non conventional caps and coil.
Actually, a kinda mix of cap and coils.

One question is: does Nature care (NRG-wise) whether or not a tank circuit is made of "normal"
caps and coils or tricky (non-conventional) ones? Seems not.

Another question is: does the AC Source will figure out (and react (Lenz law)) if
we try to get some power from a non-conventional tank circuit?

Usually, trying to get back some power from a "normal" resonating tank circuit
(with a secondary coil, for ex) leads to break his resonance and the efficiency is < 1.

Now, can we (without a secondary coil, for ex) get back some free power?
Could we cheat the source?

I have not the answer. I came across these issues reading Valdimir Utkin.
I have to make some experiments.

Gwella soñjou,
Jean
   
img  lost_bro
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #185 on: 2014-03-22, 01:02:05 »
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Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-03-22, 00:22:21
Hi Lost_Bro,

Thank you for your comment. I was talking about "purposely" added capacitance.
Actually, I had forgotten to post this picture:




-------------------

According that, in an AC circuit, a capacitance (and/or a coil) does not consume (and produce) nothing.
Notably: take a "tank circuit" (parallel resonance).
Seen from the source, it has an huge impedance. It behaves like an almost open circuit.
So, very few power is consumed from the source.
But, in this tank circuit, amperes are circulating.
Unfortunately, these amperes are considered as useless.
Fortunately, some witty guys (not me!) had the idea of designing non conventional caps and coil.
Actually, a kinda mix of cap and coils.

One question is: does Nature care (NRG-wise) whether or not a tank circuit is made of "normal"
caps and coils or tricky (non-conventional) ones? Seems not.

Another question is: does the AC Source will figure out (and react (Lenz law)) if
we try to get some power from a non-conventional tank circuit?

Usually, trying to get back some power from a "normal" resonating tank circuit
(with a secondary coil, for ex) leads to break his resonance and the efficiency is < 1.

Now, can we (without a secondary coil, for ex) get back some free power?
Could we cheat the source?

I have not the answer. I came across these issues reading Valdimir Utkin.
I have to make some experiments.

Gwella soñjou,
Jean





Hello Jean,
Yes, I understood that you were referring to induced or added Capacitance in the coil, just as S.M. did.

You are speaking of Reactive AC power, as that is the definition:
If the circuit contains reactive components, the voltage and current waveforms will be “out-of-phase” by some amount determined by the circuits phase angle.
Reactive power is produced when the current waveform is out of phase with the voltage waveform due to inductive or capacitive loads.
Current lags voltage with an inductive load, and leads voltage with a capacitive load......

(ELI the ICE man)

Only the in phase component of current  with voltage produces real or active power that does real work.

Reactive Power can best be described as the quantity of “unused” power that is developed by reactive components, such as inductors or capacitors in an AC circuit.  Yes, it bounces back and forth in the circuit, just recirculating..............

If the phase angle between the voltage and the current is at its maximum of 90 degrees, the volt-amp product will have equal positive and negative values.

In other words, the reactive circuit returns as much power to the supply as it consumes resulting in the average power consumed by the circuit being zero, as the same amount of energy keeps flowing alternately from source to the load and back from load to source.

This is what you are getting at:  tap into the reactive power , which is created by the interaction of Inductance & Capacitance...............................

An analogy used to explain these terms is that if Apparent Power is a glass of beer, Reactive Power is the foam that prevents you from filling it up all the way, so that you are left with less beer or True Power. In other words, the thirst-quenching portion of your beer is represented by KW in the pic. below. The foam is represented by KVAR. The total contents of your mug, KVA, is this summation of KW (the beer) and KVAR (the foam). In our beer mug analogy, Power Factor (P.F.) is then the ratio of Beer (True Power) to the entire volume of the mug (beer plus foam or Apparent Power.)

P.S. stole the pics. from Google......

take care, peace.
lost_bro
   
img  lost_bro
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #186 on: 2014-03-22, 02:29:48 »
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Hello All.

OK, Jean...

"One question is: does Nature care (NRG-wise) whether or not a tank circuit is made of "normal"
caps and coils or tricky (non-conventional) ones? Seems not."

"Another question is: does the AC Source will figure out (and react (Lenz law)) if
we try to get some power from a non-conventional tank circuit?"

I believe the answer lies in the Phase relationship ( I&E)  in relation to the Primary and Secondary coils.

I will quote 'Salty Citrus' from China, the developer of the Tang-Don Smith replication last year in China.

" "salty citrus" Q & A:
Question : About the 1/4 wavelength relationship, your opinion on L1 and L2; do they have a 1/4 wavelength relationship?
 Answer: I feel the 1/4 wavelength relationship is not great, the only relatively important point is the phase relationship. "

This was translated from Chinese to English, but the important part is that his group spent over two years working up to this final version and his opinion is that the Phase relationship between L1 & L2 is the hot item.

Unfortunately, he never stated what exactly was the phase relationship but I believe this information is a step in the right direction.

Take care, peace
lost_bro
   
img  Itsu
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #187 on: 2014-03-22, 11:31:43 »

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Great analogy with the beer Lost_bro,  i love it   O0



Ok,  made a rough setup with the components i had.
Still some more needs to be collected/sorted like the leds but this will be my main layout.

Regards Itsu
   
img  Matt Watts
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #188 on: 2014-03-22, 12:03:43 »
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Quote from: Itsu on 2014-03-22, 11:31:43
Ok,  made a rough setup with the components i had.
Still some more needs to be collected/sorted like the leds but this will be my main layout.

Very nice Itsu.

I think there is a wager going around that you will have this working before any of us even get circuit boards fabricated.  If you do, I'll happily send you some boards--my compliments.
   
img  Itsu
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #189 on: 2014-03-22, 13:54:23 »

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Thanks Matt Watts,

but i doubt i will be ready soon, i just have 1 week left before i am off for my work for 2 weeks.
You guys can catch up on me then  ;D

Regards Itsu
   
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Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #190 on: 2014-03-22, 14:01:44 »

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Dear all.

MenofFather posted this today on OU.C.

Quote"He also say "Транс мотайте по картинке", that means, transformer need wound like in picture, so  I understand, primary wound on one side of core, secondary on another side of core. :)
Maybe then not need screens or only one screen?
(https://dfsuknfbz46oq.cloudfront.net/p/icons/kolourpaint.png)" unquote.

This was my reply.

Quote " From that statement "transformer need wound like in picture" . I deduce that we still have T-1000's original coil layout as attached below.

We have been given a turns count L1 = 15 Turns.  L2 = 45 turns.  But the photo clearly shows us, that externally we have the same or similar height to the two coils. Suggesting to me that there are at least 30 turns underlying both halves !!  I am basing this thought on that L2 would be twice a high as L1 !!

I have also attached a picture of my Mk2 rewound transformer" unquote.

Thoughts ??

Cheers Grum.


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img  forest
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #191 on: 2014-03-22, 18:30:39 »
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Let's way what Ruslan would say about it. He promised to post new video with better resolution and details.
IMHO : 1/4 wavelength - it is important in HV and overall to maximize output voltage from flyback for example. Very hard to do something useful about it except RF and HV applications.
   
img  Itsu
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #192 on: 2014-03-22, 18:31:34 »

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Hi grumage,  its anybody's guess,  i really don't know.



I had problems in viewing the linked video from the post from Les banki over on overunity.com which was pasted to this thread
in post #159 by grumage.

This link does not work for me: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch feature=player_embedded&v=EwCS15pRtH0&list=PLC7684829E98CAD74


After fiddling around i came finally to this video which shows indeed 3 circuits of the akula 30W version:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCS15pRtH0&list=PLC7684829E98CAD74

Most difference is in how to drive the MOSFET, perhaps there is more interesting info in the audio, so for those
who understand please take a look/listen.


Thanks,  regards itsu
   
img  Peterae
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #193 on: 2014-03-22, 20:59:00 »

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Buy me some coffee
Those 3 circuits are interesting, they seem to me to be a progressive circuit development, looks to me he has been trying to find the best way to switch that fet faster, which would mean his latest circuit uses a fet driver.
   
img  Matt Watts
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #194 on: 2014-03-22, 21:19:50 »
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Quote from: Peterae on 2014-03-22, 20:59:00
Those 3 circuits are interesting, they seem to me to be a progressive circuit development, looks to me he has been trying to find the best way to switch that fet faster, which would mean his latest circuit uses a fet driver.

If my instincts are correct on this, it is the impulse that initiates the ringing between the two halves of ferrite.  So starting with the smallest duty cycle that will work is best.  Keep the on-time intact and decrease the off-time as much as possible, which will at the same time increase frequency.  My experience with pulsed coils has proved the TC4422 to be a formidable mechanism in pushing a MOSFET or IGBT as hard as it can go.  I suspect building flexibility and hefty overkill into a transformer test bed will allow us to hit the sweet spot and possibly variant transformer designs that can go beyond the 30 watt Akula unit.  Myself, I have my eye on a large split toroid transformer design, but will focus on baby steps until we get a handle on this thing.
   
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Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #195 on: 2014-03-22, 21:29:04 »

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Indeed

It's easy to start planning a large unit but definitely we need to get the baby going so we can analyse the circumstances creating the effect, who knows once the mechanism is understood then there's no reason not to be able to design a 3-4kw off grid house unit.
   
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Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #196 on: 2014-03-22, 21:32:49 »

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Quote from: Peterae on 2014-03-22, 21:29:04
Indeed

It's easy to start planning a large unit but definitely we need to get the baby going so we can analyse the circumstances creating the effect, who knows once the mechanism is understood then there's no reason not to be able to design a 3-4kw off grid house unit.

 ;)  :)   O0


---------------------------
Nanny state ? Left at the gate !! :)
   
img  4Tesla
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #197 on: 2014-03-23, 05:31:23 »
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@new members
Welcome to the forum!  O0

@Itsu
Nice work on your build!  8)
   
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Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #198 on: 2014-03-23, 06:04:14 »
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I pulled the original MOSFET version of the 30W schematic from the video.
   
img  4Tesla
Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #199 on: 2014-03-23, 06:15:53 »
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This is a quick graphic of what I hear some are saying that the transformer primary is under the secondary.  This might be, but it doesn't seem to match the picture.
   
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