Just thinking aloud - TPU

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Author Topic: Just thinking aloud - TPU (Read 68644 times)

Matt Watts	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #100 on: 2014-07-17, 17:33:22 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: Smudge on 2014-07-17, 16:21:33 I think this could really lead somewhere. Me too. I really like this line of reasoning because it seems to map nicely with what we think the architecture of the TPU looks like. What still mystifies me are the control coils. Is there some sort of mechanism that would energize these things naturally and at the proper timing as the charge bunches move through the collection wire? Looking at the TPU as a complete system, I'm still very curious about how the device "spins-up". Because it takes time in the order of seconds, not micro-seconds, something tells me there is a linear relationship going on; maybe a transition through many frequency ranges until some bound is hit where the device stabilizes, or the resistance in the conductors overtakes the cyclic gain. However, based on the quote G posted, some components may not restrict this cyclic gain enough and the device will subsequently self destruct. If we only knew how the control coils were wired... I think the evidence and the math will begin to answer this question.

giantkiller	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #101 on: 2014-07-17, 17:57:11 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 1593 Frequency equals matter...	Follow me on this: The final control coils could be an encompassing magnetic field. This would also fit many fine wires, flux. The dc bias would also supply this. Lends itself to bunching like a transmission line. Going with that look at the spiral wound vertical on the horizontal/dc bias. IT WOULD SQUEEZE LIKE A CANNON. But in a spiral motion. When the control is released the dc bias will force back to equilibrium. I try this tonight. The setup is on the bench. 'Warping the aether' as stated by Dollard. 'The motions and strains of the Ether give rise to electrification.' as stated by Ken l. Wheeler. --------------------------- http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/

Peterae	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #102 on: 2014-07-17, 18:52:32 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3961	There was a remark by SM saying you need to think about a plane breaking the soundbarrier and the trouble the engineers had designing to survive the shockwave, maybe someone knows the paragraph with his words, it would appear a certain speed is needed.

giantkiller	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #103 on: 2014-07-17, 19:04:30 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 1593 Frequency equals matter...	Squeezing a field in space also refers to the Kunel patent. --------------------------- http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/

Smudge	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #104 on: 2014-07-17, 19:19:55 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 1940	Quote from: Grumpy on 2014-07-17, 17:28:58 Imagine a homopolar generator using just fields and forces rather than a solid conductive rotor. Here is an excerpt from a lengthy conversation I had with GFT about this method of induction: The more interesting result is the GFT induction equation where tExB=qr or (E/omega)xB=qr where t=1/omega= 1/frequency. Frequency implies spin or precession. Again, I stress implies not proves. However if that is the case look at what the equation implies. If we apply a magnetic field perpendicularly to a spinning or precessing electric field then we induce the creation of qr or polarized charge. This sound very similar to what I predicted for the homopolar generator (see 11/04/2012 12:49 reply) VI:27:5 The Gravitational Effects on the HPG: Simulation of the Magnetic Field Through Precession. In that case we simulated a magnetic field by precessing the disc. In this case we simulate torque by rotating the field thus inducing qr, the electric dipole, as polarized charge. I actually found an article that supports this: http://phys.org/news113146441.html. Note that the article says “At first glance it is surprising that the spin can be rotated by an electric field. However, we know from the Theory of Relativity that a moving electron can ‘feel’ an electric field as though it were a magnetic field. Researchers …forced an electron to move through a rapidly-changing electric field…they showed that it was indeed possible to turn the spin of the electron by doing so.” It is well known that a changing electric field produces a magnetic field, just as a changing magnetic field produces an electric field. Nussbaum's "Electromagnetic Theory for Engineers and Scientists" covers this quite well. You can replace the electric field with Maxwell's displacement current and there is a magnetic field associated with that current. If you place a ring core around a parallel plate capacitor, that core will be magnetized by the displacement current. Even if that capacitor is a long dielectric rod with electrodes on the ends (to remove the conduction currents away from the ring core) the core still gets magnetized by the changing E field. But it has to be a rapid change to get any useful results. And if the change is rapid enough the resultant magnetic field can flip electrons. No need to invoke precession here. Smudge

Grumpy	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #105 on: 2014-07-17, 19:33:12 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 3948 tExB=qr	Quote from: Smudge on 2014-07-17, 19:19:55 ... No need to invoke precession here. Smudge I think precession is required.

Smudge	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #106 on: 2014-07-17, 19:35:23 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 1940	Just as an aside and while we are talking about precession the attached document explains how Larmor precession can be used as a charge pump and pump a current into a load. Smudge ------------------------ Spin driven electrical currents.pdf (669.63 kB - downloaded 695 times.)

ion	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #107 on: 2014-07-17, 19:39:00 »
Group: Elite Hero Member Posts: 3537 It's turtles all the way down	Here is the quote Quote I want you to start and think of the generator principles the exact same way that passing the sound barrier was accomplished. Read how the engineers in this country finally developed the proper wing design to accomplish super sonic speed in aircraft. I hope it will give you a picture of what is going on inside the generator and especially the collector. --------------------------- "Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy

Peterae	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #108 on: 2014-07-17, 19:43:18 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3961	Thanks ION thats the one

Matt Watts	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #109 on: 2014-07-17, 20:35:18 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: Peterae on 2014-07-17, 19:43:18 Thanks ION thats the one And the answer is: Quote from: century-of-flight.net Then NACA aerodynamicist Richard Whitcomb reasoned that the smoothest airflow over an aircraft would be achieved if the cross-section of the craft increased smoothly from front to back. This would be a problem once the wings started to protrude from the plane. The solution was to pinch the fuselage in at the wings: the result was the classic “Coke bottle” design of supersonic aircraft. The revised design of the F-102 yielded a fighter that achieved speeds of Mach 1.2 with no other change in the plane.

Peterae	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #110 on: 2014-07-17, 22:13:06 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3961	Thanks Matt Not sure how that fits in

Matt Watts	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #111 on: 2014-07-20, 04:27:23 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: ION on 2014-07-17, 15:42:48 Very few have tried an electrostatic field sequentially applied to each each segment. The electrostatic field may produce the necessary constriction (squeezing of the hose) that induces movement, whereas induction in a coil segments creates also a BEMF when the field collapses that negates positive forward motion. Sequential pulsing of coils works in e.g.motors because of the mass, hence inertia of the rotor. Maybe electrons are quickly drawn back due to the collapsing field, they having much lower inertia, the dipole preferred orientation is reversed. Electrostatic squeezing could be the key. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Asa6miVcUKA Watch that video a few times and see if you can imagine an electric/magnetic concept that would do the same thing with electrons as this pump does with fluid. Get that far yet? Now go a step further and see what it would take to make that concept self-sustaining.

ion	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #112 on: 2014-07-20, 07:20:24 »
Group: Elite Hero Member Posts: 3537 It's turtles all the way down	From a compilation of SM important phrases: Quote You know, it is very similar to the idea of a long garden hose. Picture a hose with water in it. If you pick up one end and move along the length of the hose you will move the water constantly along in the direction you are moving. You could also squeeze the hose in the direction to move the water along as well. and you could do both to control the movement of the water more precisely. You can think of the movement of water as the movement of electrons through the collector coils. To be self sustaining, the power required to move (lift, squeeze etc) the electrons would have to be less than the power produced. For normal induction this is not possible due to Lenz, however SM implied it was a "new way to create electron movement in a conductor" (paraphrased), in other words it is not Faraday induction. --------------------------- "Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy

cheappower2012	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #113 on: 2014-07-21, 02:15:06 »
Group: Guest	To ION Here is a possible solution to your generation of current not using conventional induction.In the Tariel,aquarium 2,this is also used,the pictures have been altered, that is parts not important for clarity have been removed.The transformer used in the device is from a 1982 IBM Russian 360 clone,its original purpose is to provide,3,12 volt supplies,it operates from 220 vac 3 phase,it can at most pass 1 amp on ac side due to size of primary windings. In the drawing it shows that it is impossible for it to work,however here is a speculative theory in another part of the device a large series of pulses are created,these can be thought of as similar to waves,altho having no frequency,they carry energy.There is an unknown energy source part of the device is able to utilize some of this energy to create these waves.The physical size of the waves is very small,they pass thru the copper wire of the coil,however some do collide with electrons of the copper that are part of outer orbits,and transfer this energy to the electrons,as the waves journey thru the copper wire more and more electrons,are given this energy.The current keeps increasing,until the waves reach the end of the copper wire.I believe that this also is used in the tpu,however the tpu uses another component this limits the power you can get,it also creates heat.The Tariel device can generate much greater power than the tpu because it does not use this component.With the aquarium 2 video there is talk of it being fake, the problem is , the ground connection was removed,and the device ran for a time without the ground,according to someone involved. The device was ran for 4.5 hours,the purpose of the investigative team was to get the rights to the Tariel device,to make it and sell it. There is no wire seen in the HR pictures showing a wire to a grid connection connected to the blue wire,this would have been obvious to the team right off never assume everybody is incompetent.A very small wire would never handle 10 amps,there is no connection of a grid wire close to the transformer.To me this more than enough to investigate this,other people can either believe it or not. The sparking has nothing to do with the operation its there to create,"its a Tesla invention" a red herring. ------------------------ Just thinking aloud - TPU TK+0538666.JPG (166.32 kB, 1296x968 - viewed 765 times.) Just thinking aloud - TPU trans666.JPG (96.31 kB, 1296x968 - viewed 733 times.) Just thinking aloud - TPU coil.JPG (15.67 kB, 500x360 - viewed 699 times.)

Matt Watts	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #114 on: 2014-07-21, 06:26:27 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2014-07-21, 02:15:06 The sparking has nothing to do with the operation its there to create,"its a Tesla invention" a red herring. I think Wesley actually speculated the spark was used as a limiter to prevent a run-away condition. If the stars are actually aligning here, I'll speculate Steven Mark never thought of using a spark gap as a limiter.

ion	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #115 on: 2014-07-21, 15:02:18 »
Group: Elite Hero Member Posts: 3537 It's turtles all the way down	cheapower2012 Thanks for your input, it is appreciated. I have not done in depth study of the TK devices, so will defer to your better knowledge of them. Quote here is a speculative theory in another part of the device a large series of pulses are created,these can be thought of as similar to waves,altho having no frequency,they carry energy.There is an unknown energy source part of the device is able to utilize some of this energy to create these waves.The physical size of the waves is very small,they pass thru the copper wire of the coil,however some do collide with electrons of the copper that are part of outer orbits,and transfer this energy to the electrons,as the waves journey thru the copper wire more and more electrons,are given this energy.The current keeps increasing,until the waves reach the end of the copper wire.I believe that this also is used in the tpu,however the tpu uses another component this limits the power you can get,it also creates heat.The Tariel device can generate much greater power than the tpu because it does not use this component This is interesting, have you done any tests to prove this hypothesis? Also what is the "another component" and why play the guessing game, why not just name it. If it were a component that generates the heat as you say I would think the heat would be localized to that component rather than spread over the windings. Looking forward to your unveiling "the component". Cheers, ION --------------------------- "Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy

giantkiller	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #116 on: 2014-07-22, 00:04:37 »
Group: Elite Experimentalist Hero Member Posts: 1593 Frequency equals matter...	Radiation resistance... --------------------------- http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/

cheappower2012	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #117 on: 2014-07-22, 00:34:05 »
Group: Guest	To ION Tariels device is an interesting thing,in the beginning I believed it was a fraud,the Turkey video changed my opinion. The device was ac based not dc based,I suspected that it might be related to the tpu.However Tariel kept a part hidden in all of hes devices so you were dealing with a black box.One of the people involved with the aquarium 2 team,told me he talks to Tariel,Tariel told him one component he makes or modifies.Because in every video he hides the component to analyze what the component is,is impossible.In one video called the green box video it was theorized by a member to be a fraud,because a clampmeter showed 20 something amps from a ground connection.It would indicate a hidden grid wire this would be the most logical choice.When I simulated (hardware model)the parts of the circuit related to Tesla ,I got a reading indicating a large current 23 amps like the video from ground,when I turned on the power the current would disappear like it was real,turns out it was a phantom current,created by the conditions of a Tesla interface(hv,coils,ground spark gap).The cheap clampmeter,has a defect that under these conditions it shows a large current reading when theres none. The cheap clampmeter I have is made by the same company as the meter Tariel used,my conclusion is Tariel used this effect in hes demo to create the illusion that its a Tesla invention,there is no ground current no hidden grid wire.As to have I tested this hypothesis no,at this time its a speculated theory,however its based on other information that has been experimented with,you have to have a starting point,this is not like a college class,your dealing with, it maybe or maybe not be is the rule,different tactics have to be employed. You know from experience that it(tpu) is incredibly hard to solve,people have tried for years with no success. Progress is very slow,I don't build untill I have all the information that I feel is needed. What happens in this forum and at overunity is people build blindly,they believe they will succeed however none of there builds work(no overunity). As to what is the mystery component it is our old friend the bifilar coil,however its applied in a different way.Its not widely known but SM knows Tesla stuff backwards and forwards,this is why he used it, I got the idea from a video on youtube and used a slightly different approach,I believe its used as a collector,the first part of the coil is used as the path for the waves as the current builds,it goes to ground this produces a collapsing field magnetic field ,the second part of the coil is used for transfer of energy,this is rectified and then filtered,the rectifier is needed as a gate.The primary heats up mainly this part is not speculative,I have done this,with hardware,I also experimented with a pancake coils in this manner. You know your self that the collector of the large tpu is most likely an air core air cores require a very high frequency,the tpu shows nothing of the sort,it is contrary to logic.I have over the years, broken the tpu into component parts,I work on different aspects of it,also on fakery parts ,that is how SM creates misinformation effects in hes videos.The ultimate goal is to present all the information in one place and open source it .Provide the information to people researching the tpu set the direction,get other people involved,by going thru different possibilities I believe its a matter of a very short time before we see a real device. I also plan on open sourcing the information on the Tariel device,so one or the other will succeed. The problem in the past is there is very little good information,so one person does this another does that you never build on anything,you continually start at the beginning,so no progress. Both the tpu and the Tariel device are low tech devices both devices work because there exists an unknown energy source this source is not ZPE or anything like this,it has a few different rules not complex but strange.In the aquarium 2 video the active component is that funny green transformer its generating 2kw,the transformer generates the waves,it is also used to feed a second circuit this is used to generate current to feed back to the other components to keep the device working,closed loop. In both cases of SM and Tariel it was an accidental discovery,in SM's case I have a good idea of it in Tariels case I don't,both are influenced by Tesla,and a mystical view of reality .

Grumpy	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #118 on: 2014-07-22, 02:10:42 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 3948 tExB=qr	TK may be using the same HV pulsed magnetic effect that Energia Celeste used. He could easily dump extra energy trough a gap to ground, and/or use this circuit to power another coil for the magnetic field. Output will be pulsed. One clue is that he started the green-box device with the car battery, another is when the young gentleman was shocked by something on the green box (metal switch?). Each of you could set it up in a weekend as a proof of concept. ------------------------ Energia Celeste Patent.pdf (1218.4 kB - downloaded 361 times.) « Last Edit: 2014-07-22, 14:37:42 by Grumpy »

cheappower2012	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #119 on: 2014-07-23, 00:38:04 »
Group: Guest	To Grumpy The TK device is operated by 220 vac,an inverter is powered by the 12 volt battery,the input to the device plugs into the inverter. The person that looked like he got shocked didn't,he put hes fingers into a fan used for cooling some transistors on top of the green case near 2 black heat sinks. This device outputs 220 vac the tpu outputs dc,he ran a step down transformer with a bridge rectifier from the ac output,this is used to loop the device. In theory if this were a fake(battery powered) it could still be looped,the missing information is the wattage of the lights used,a 1,000 watts seems too high for an ordinary light,I don't know what they make in that part of the world(Georgia).A hidden grid wire is out because its a situation of a black box no useful information can be obtained by this particular device,it could be real or battery powered.

Grumpy	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #120 on: 2014-07-23, 02:06:51 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 3948 tExB=qr	Regarding the TK green box device, I thought that the device in the can with holes in the lid was a homemade converter (AC or DC pulses to DC), and the blue box was an inverter (DC-AC). So the output could be DC pulses. Regardless, HV pulses, a large coil, and a magnet will dispel all of this.

cheappower2012	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #121 on: 2014-07-23, 05:12:40 »
Group: Guest	to Grumpy Whats in the can is a step-down transformer with a bridge rectifier,220vac to 12 vdc,yes the 12 volts is pulsing dc.To operate the transformer it takes ac,so the output of this device is ac at a line frequency. The purpose of having a visible looping is to convince people it is real,in an earlier video the looping was not visible and you could not tell if the output was dc or ac. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lH2Mb6auNA

Hoppy	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #122 on: 2014-07-23, 10:41:06 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2014-07-23, 00:38:04 A hidden grid wire is out because its a situation of a black box no useful information can be obtained by this particular device,it could be real or battery powered. If no useful information can be obtained, then logically a hidden grid wire could also equally be in.

wings	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #123 on: 2014-07-23, 14:19:05 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: Grumpy on 2014-07-22, 02:10:42 TK may be using the same HV pulsed magnetic effect that Energia Celeste used. He could easily dump extra energy trough a gap to ground, and/or use this circuit to power another coil for the magnetic field. Output will be pulsed. One clue is that he started the green-box device with the car battery, another is when the young gentleman was shocked by something on the green box (metal switch?). Each of you could set it up in a weekend as a proof of concept. what do you think about the device is a pre_alignement spins ? similar to https://pines.berkeley.edu/research/hyperpolarization

Grumpy	Re: Just thinking aloud - TPU « Reply #124 on: 2014-07-23, 14:51:27 »
Group: Tinkerer Hero Member Posts: 3948 tExB=qr	To GFT In this thread: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=979650b42e989c2bf3c4bdb97a56f681&topic=265.msg40229#msg40229 I posted some comments from username "GFT" regarding homopolar generators that are interesting. Particular the part about a change in a ascalr field that yield a Lorentz force, which in-turn invokes and current and subsequent Lorentz force. I copied this section of GFT's reply as follows: Quote “The conventional theory of electromagnetism perfectly explains the functioning of the Faraday disk, both qualitatively and quantitatively.” This statement is almost correct although you back into while all the time, making false claims to justify it. The behavior is based upon first generating a change in the electric field which generates a magnetic field which induces magnetic precession which is equivalent to the induction of an electric current. Conventional theory misses that initial change in the electrostatic field. . Remember the charge has to first be moving before one can apply F=qvB. Conventional theory concentrates more upon the effects of changing the magnetic field or cutting the lines of magnetic flux. This approach isn’t wrong but it is incomplete. One must realize that according to my Law of Dimensions the Lorentz force may be expressed as a. F=qvxB b. F=qvB c. F=qrB/t d. F=q(Br)/t e. F=irB f. F=irB g. F=qvB All seven of these equations are algebraically equivalent and all seven, via the tenets of the law of Dimensions must find physical expression. (I’m pretty sure there are actually even more algebraic expressions of this law.) Suppose we start with equation g. Note the absence of the asterisk thus denoting the absence of a cross product thus a scalar or electrostatic product. This denotes we impart a velocity to charge even though the B field and the velocity vector are parallel. However in such a rotating disk every v vector represents a radius and therefore every v vector will have an orthogonal counterpart. Thus for every g equation there is and MUST BE a corresponding b equation. Note equation b is induced in the sense it exists primarily because the quantity qv, the change, (v), of the electrostatic field, (q), of equation g was generated first. One may be quick to assert that if F=qvB is electrostatic then it has to be the Coulomb force and equation g clearly does not present algebraically as the Coulomb force. But I prove quite conclusively that the Lorentz force and the Coulomb force are indeed equivalent. I can derive one from the other quite easily. It’s listed in the book. Indeed there is and must be an equivalent expression of the Lorentz force or Coulomb’s law along all three axes, x,y and z. Indeed that 3rd force is Newton’s gravitational force law and once again I demonstrate in the book how Newton’s gravitational force constant, G, can be expressed in terms of Coulomb’s law. So, we have a force produced by a scalar or electrostatic product F=qvB which gives rise to F=qvB Isn't this the conventional Lorentz force that is associated with current in a conductor? 1. Are these equations saying that a current is induced by an initial scalar field force? 2. You also stated that: E/B=qv is the same as Ex-B=qv and you stated earlier that E=Bxqv [this is just the common Lorentz equation] and The Lorentz force says E=(qr/t)xB Therefore Ex(-B)=qr/t and the induction equation is ExB=qr/t (same as) tExB=qr What is the physical explanation of these two different induction equations? 3. what about the other induction equation ExB=ir ?

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